Carrie Underwood – “Cowboy Casanova”

Jim Malec | September 3rd, 2009

carrie-underwood-cowboy-casanovaIf this were 1992, and the release of this song came on the boot scootin’ heels of the “Achy Breaky Heart” line dance craze, it would be an understandable entry from a new country act trying to score some face-time on TNN’s Wildhorse Saloon Dance Show; thanks to its hard-pounding rhythm and infectious melody, “Cowboy Casanova” (written by Underwood, Brett James and Mike Elizondo), will lead suburban country bumpkins onto the dance floor in flocks.

Since this is 2009, however, and since Carrie Underwood is already near the apex of country music stardom, it’s a perplexing choice of material. Carrie Underwood could take a pop-country version of “The Itsy Bitsy Spider” to the top of the charts. After all, every song she’s ever released has gone to either #1 or #2. The fact that this, too, will be a hit says nothing about its quality.

Underwood is beautiful, personable and she has a clear, crystalline voice comparable to few in music. On this song, that voice is lucid, commanding, and demonstrates some of the vocal refinement missing from her sophomore disc Carnival Ride.

But as a song, “Cowboy Casanova” is pure dead weight, surviving on only the energy Underwood breathes into it. Beyond that infusion of life, it is an irrelevant mash-up of general and clichéd descriptions of an anonymous country bad boy who is “candy coated misery.” And given the fact that it would be a challenge to find a song Underwood couldn’t score a smash with, we have to wonder why she would settle for something so perfectly inane.

Country music fans will always love Carrie Underwood. She has won their hearts. But there will come a time when she’s no longer the hottest property in the business. At that point, she’ll see that the number of #1 singles she accumulated will not be nearly as relevant as how well people remember, and were affected by, those #1 singles. And she’ll see that songs like this do little to build the long-term resiliency of her career

“Cowboy Casanova” will rack up airplay. It’ll drive sales. And it’ll provide a wonderful musical setting for her inevitable award show performances. But it won’t further Underwood’s position as an icon. And and it certainly won’t be remembered or beloved when her career’s sizzling status begins to simmer. Topical, uninteresting and unoriginal, it positions Underwood as an artist molded by the gears of the Nashville machine, as opposed to one with her own vision and who exists on a stage apart from her so-called competition.

Underwood is a young woman with a once-in-a-lifetime voice who could literally take any artistic path; that she chooses the most trodden path of all is an example of one of music’s most tragic wastes of talent.

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  1. [...] Carrie Underwood – “Cowboy Casanova” (the9513.com) [...]
  1. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 1:37 pm

    Not to mention that this song was already done better by Christina Aguilera last year when it was called “Candy Man” and was actually fun.

  2. Nicolas
    September 3, 2009 at 2:25 pm

    I like this song, its got a good feel to it and her voice sounds great on it <3 She sings powerful but still with some restraint

  3. Jed
    September 3, 2009 at 2:26 pm

    You must be crazy and have no taste. Roughstock loved this song.

  4. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 2:29 pm

    R not crazy. R SANE.

  5. Erik
    September 3, 2009 at 2:31 pm

    Yes, because everyone who disagrees with Roughstock are insane..

  6. Stewman
    September 3, 2009 at 2:38 pm

    This would fall into the category of “goin’ to the well one too many times”.

  7. mikeky
    September 3, 2009 at 2:53 pm

    I don’t mind the song. It ain’t country, but it’s not a horrible song. For the record, though: one of the co-writers is Mike Elizondo. Elizondo’s most famous credit would be co-producer of Dr. Dre’s Chronic CDs. He’s a producer (and keyboard player) on hip-hop records. I might note he’s a really good one–but not country.

  8. Jo
    September 3, 2009 at 3:03 pm

    So you do think she has talent?

  9. Love Your Haters
    September 3, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    WOW! 9513 and haters.You’re gonna seriously tell me that Carrie hasn’t stand out from others with this song.This song sounds like nothing that’s currently on country radio.Which by the way is so freaking boring right now and dull country.Without Carrie in this genre I wouldn’t even listen to it.I grew up on r&b, and not too many r&b people make the move to country.But her voice and talent is undeniable.Have you listen to radio lately.I’d rather have this than that other crap.At least I know aside from the radio and studio she can sing her behind off.Carrie is doing country music a favor.With her voice she chose to sing country music-she didn’t have to.And if she ever leaves country, then I’m done listening to country.Hate on.Without haters ya’ll where would we be.

  10. Evie
    September 3, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    Jim, I have got to say, that I honestly just don’t respect your opinions anymore and I am serious about that. You treat Carrie with so much unwarranted disdain that I seriously have to question your motives. You just seem to enjoy ripping into her and it is a little creepy. The good news is, that so many people recognize her talent and reward her for it.

  11. Dr. No
    September 3, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    Who says “record machine” anymore?

  12. Dr. No
    September 3, 2009 at 3:09 pm

    Love Your Haters,

    You’re right, it doesn’t sound like anything on country radio right now. However, it’s still not country, and neither is everything else on country radio right now.

  13. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 3:12 pm

    I do listen to the radio, but likely not the same radio you are thinking about.

    As for standing out–she does that. But is being the worst thing since Keri Harvick really how Carrie should want to be noticed?

  14. Stephen
    September 3, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    I think this is a fair review. This song is country-pop. Not traditional, not even close. It’s contemporary country so let’s not pretend it’s “extremely” country or anything because we fans are kidding ourselves.

    I respect that you dislike this song, but I have to disagree that it is deadweight. I agree that Carrie’s voice brings this song to a higher point (which is something you have criticized her for before, so I am glad you acknowledged this) but I also feel that lyrically this song is pretty unique.

    I would give this a thumbs up, but I’m a fan, so I lack some objectivity. (Though, even objectively speaking, I’d give this a thumbs up.)

    Agree to disagree.

  15. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    As for where we would be without haters–WE would be in the middle of a Neko Case-Kasey Chambers-OCMS-Dale Watson love fest with no Carrie related interruptions. Where would YOU be?

  16. Chris N.
    September 3, 2009 at 3:14 pm

    You can love your haters, just don’t hate your lovers.

  17. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 3:17 pm

    Chris: But that….there are way….

    Aw dammit. I can’t respond to that and keep it PG.

  18. Chris J
    September 3, 2009 at 3:21 pm

    Normally I hate any underwood song but, this one is different…Her voice doesn’t even ruin the song…I like it…I wwas slightly worried when I heard the begining ohs

  19. Jo
    September 3, 2009 at 3:21 pm

    What’s with the need for two reviews? Do y’all hate her that much. But hey I guess it bring more hits to your website right?

  20. Stephen
    September 3, 2009 at 3:23 pm

    Yeah the second review is ridiculous. Just when I thought the9513 was being fair, they throw that in our face. To be fair, it’s a guest contributor. I guarantee you that guy is a hater though, haha.

  21. kyle
    September 3, 2009 at 3:34 pm

    All you haters are out of your minds!!! IMO this is one of Carrie’s strongest singles, and it’s chart success will sooner or later prove that. This song is catchy, fun, and capped off with Carrie’s amazing vocals! I have no respect for 9513′s reviews, you clearly just hate Carrie. Probably because hating Carrie gets you more attention. Your opinions are always wrong proven so by the success Carrie has had. Overall, your blunt stupidity Makes your opinion simply a waste of space on the page.

  22. Paul W Dennis
    September 3, 2009 at 3:36 pm

    My thumb is sideways on this one – I won’t turn the radio off (or switch stations) if this comes on the air but it really is a trifle, unworthy of her voice and talent

  23. Jim Malec
    September 3, 2009 at 3:40 pm

    Evidently, I’ve had to remove the second review because our template doesn’t allow for comments on that type of posting (technically, it was a page rather than a post). Comments related to that review shouldn’t be posted here, so we will probably move that review into the forums. Sorry for any confusion related to that..

  24. Vance
    September 3, 2009 at 3:44 pm

    Seems like a fair review to me. It’s not her best work and I believe that the criticisms of the song are definitely acceptable.

  25. Chris D.
    September 3, 2009 at 3:44 pm

    Honestly, I really like this song… The lyrics are definitely empty, but I really like the sound and her voice on it. Definitely better than Carnival Ride…

  26. Baron Lane
    September 3, 2009 at 3:46 pm

    I love they contrast this drek with Stand By Your Man…like it needed more draw attention to how horrendous it is (oooooow! is right)

  27. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 3:51 pm

    Chris D: You don’t have to defend this. We will make the Care Bears release your puppy some other way. :)

  28. Lanibug
    September 3, 2009 at 3:56 pm

    Sadly, I have to agree with Stormy, but would have never thought of it in that way…it does in a way remind me of Christina’s Candy Man….and sorry call me a hater all you want, but I would turn the station, etc. if the song came on the radio, which is what I always do when one of her songs comes on the radio….and someone mentions that one of the songwriters is a producer from Dr. Dre and that is supposed to make it more country??? Or make me like it more???

  29. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 4:01 pm

    Candy Man and Cowboy Casanova use a lot of the same themes and cliches.

  30. Gavin
    September 3, 2009 at 4:24 pm

    Neko Case-Kasey Chambers-OCMS-Dale Watson

    Carrie would never want to do what these artists are doing and that is barely making enough money to support their next album. I know the type of artists that are supported here and hardly any are commercial. I wish you guys weren’t such music snobs.

  31. Jack
    September 3, 2009 at 4:26 pm

    I respect Jim, the reviewer. I don’t think he has an ax to grind with Carrie, but he does have expectations with regards to how he thinks she should use her talent. Fair enough. I, however, have different expectations. I want to be thrilled by Carrie’s singing period. And, I’ve been thrilled many times by her. Not all the time, but a lot of the time. I think Cowboy Casanova is a fun song – I can’t wait to dance to it. I think the lyrics are clever, the tune is infectious, and the singing superb. That is enough for me to give it a thumbs up. The difference between me and Jim, is that I don’t have a niche I want Carrie to fit in. I look for well crafted, well sung, fun songs and that is enough for me.

    I know Carrie is capable of the sort of artistic display that Jim wants to hear. We’ve all heard her sing songs like “Make the World Go Away” or “San Antonio Rose” expressively and effectively. I’m sure she will one day make a disk of the sort of original songs that Jim is waiting for. He can wait, I will wait to, but in the meantime I’m enjoying the songs she is putting out now.

  32. stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 4:37 pm

    What is commerically sucessful? For all the money being thrown at country radio to get airplay, not a lot of mainstream country singers have had a bigger opening week this year than Neko did.

  33. ivantot12
    September 3, 2009 at 4:44 pm

    uhm..this song is the best Carrie has done as a single yet. your jelous of her huh? because of her success and her amazing voice. seriously, you guys need to stop being immature.

  34. Erik
    September 3, 2009 at 4:46 pm

    Yes, were all jelous of her because shes rich and has talent beyond our wildest dreamz! lolz, haha.

  35. Rick
    September 3, 2009 at 5:03 pm

    Oh Jim, why did you have to go and wake the Carrie Fanbots from their typically dormant mental state…

  36. Sam G
    September 3, 2009 at 5:04 pm

    If this is the best she’s done as a single, I’d hate to listen to her at her worst.

  37. Angie
    September 3, 2009 at 6:14 pm

    Au contraire: if this is the worst she’s done as a single, her best is going to be sublime. Unless of course, y’all are into Taylor Swift LOL.

  38. Jen
    September 3, 2009 at 6:21 pm

    “it positions Underwood as an artist molded by the gears of the Nashville machine”

    Very well said. Nashville just flat out sucks, for lack of a better word, these days. Country music? Come ON. This song is why I DON’T listen to “country” radio anymore. Listen to folks like Miranda Lambert, Chris Knight, Alan Jackson, Cross Canadian Ragweed, Pat Green, Buddy & Julie Miller, etc…THAT’S country music. Country music is supposed to be something you tap your foot to on your front porch pickin’ a guitar. Can you do that with this song and half the crap on there? Nope.

  39. Vicki
    September 3, 2009 at 6:35 pm

    So true! I agree..Jim wrote a very honest review on this song. He said Carrie was a good singer..but the song was not. I love Carrie but this song is ok. The ending especially is “ho-hum”. I admit I like the start but it’s like they didn’t know how to finish it with something meaningful. Ok Catchy start..then dig deep and find real words, heartfelt that makes you so angry that he’s a Cowboy Casanova. Not a repeat…repeat..(sighhhhhhhhh) repeat and end.

  40. agent713
    September 3, 2009 at 6:42 pm

    I agree with Vicki. The first part of the song makes her voice sound strained (even though she CAN hit those notes, doesn’t mean she has to) and the end is boring.

    Doesn’t mean I’ll change the station when I hear it but I won’t stop to listen to it through either.

  41. Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 6:43 pm

    Angie: You know that there are more than two female country singers, right? You know that, right?

  42. J.R. Journey
    September 3, 2009 at 6:47 pm

    Meh. The song sounds like a Shania Twain reject – is Mutt Lange producing Carrie now?

  43. Nicolas
    September 3, 2009 at 7:30 pm

    ^ As if the songs Shania Twain actually did cut are particularily good, anyway

  44. Tonny
    September 3, 2009 at 7:38 pm

    Sounds awesome… although sounds like part three… lol.

    Before he cheats – Part 1
    Last name – Part 2
    Cowboy Casanova – Part 3

    Seems like she is healing nicely, songwise… lol.

  45. Johnny Paycheck
    September 3, 2009 at 7:40 pm

    This song + carrie’s voice is like poop on a popsicle stick. And most of the comments that want to say its great because it’s Carrie are just poop

  46. lanibug
    September 3, 2009 at 7:41 pm

    JR, you scare me sometimes, that is what I was thinking, but I did not want the Shania fanbots after me as well…

  47. Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 7:50 pm

    Tonny: The first songs she spazes out and destroys some guys stuff because he broke up with her (possibly because she’s crazy). Second song she gets so completely wasted that she can’t even remember getting married. Third song she is spazzing out because one of the guys she boned somewhere in there (possibly the guy whose name she can’t remember) isn’t falling off his feet in love with her.

    Healing nicely from what?

  48. Allison
    September 3, 2009 at 8:16 pm

    Surprise Surprise. Yet another thumb down from the 9513 for Carrie Underwood.

    I disagree with everything you said, as usual. The song is a kick butt rocking song that is getting AMAZING reviews all over the internet and by radio programmers and djs…not to mention it is Loved by her fans, of course.

    I assume you already have your review of Carrie’s new album ready to go…you just need the song list so you can cut and paste your Failing review from her last 2 albums.

    Why wait until 11-3? Review her album now. We already know what you are going to say.. so why go through the pretense of prending that you are being fair?

    Your hate and bias against Carrie is really taking away from the credibility of this blog. Otherwise, I enjoy your articles for the most part.

    Carrie will be, once again, laughing at you all the way to the bank, as this is going to be the biggest song of her career. It is exploding like a rocket…and it is going to steam roll past everything in its wake on the radio charts.

    THUMBS UP!!!

  49. Allison
    September 3, 2009 at 8:23 pm

    Funny, I see the names here in the comment section are rhe same Carrie haters that crawl out of the woodwork every single time Carrie is mentioned.

    Don’t you guys have a hobbyIt is getting really old. If only one of you would actually have an open mind about Carrie, I might respect your opinions more.

    But alas, once again, you band together and mock both Carrie and her fans, for no cause or reason.

    The song is incredible, and so is Carrie. 30 years from now, maybe you will reluctantly admit that Carrie has talent and had a tremendous career. Until then, enjoy your moment of triumph, in trashing Carrie for no good reason.

    As said above, she will be flying high with or without your approval.The song is fantastic, and it is the catchiest, most fun, sassy, rocking song to hit country radio in years.

    Country radio these days is getting really boring, let’s be honest. It is dominated by Taylor Swift’s bubble gum pop, and the usual suspects.

    This song was a much needed breath of fresh air on a stale country radio format right now.

    Rock on Carrie. This is the best song of her career so far.

  50. Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 8:28 pm

    My hobby is posting negative comments about Carrie on message boards.

  51. Melody
    September 3, 2009 at 8:41 pm

    Personally I love it and think Carrie is only getting better and better. Fan for life!

  52. Jaime
    September 3, 2009 at 8:46 pm

    I just don’t get the Carrie appeal. At all.

  53. Johnny Paycheck
    September 3, 2009 at 9:01 pm

    Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 8:28 pm Permalink My hobby is posting negative comments about Carrie on message boards.

    Stormy I like your hobby, where do I sign up? And is there a weekly or monthly magazine?

  54. Gavin
    September 3, 2009 at 9:03 pm

    Jim,
    Why didn’t you just review this for what it was a fun, catchy pop/rock country song. We all saw what happened to Miranda Lambert’s Dead Flowers as it died on the charts. You release a song that grabs attention and sells albums and for Carrie Underwood and her team this was a brilliant move. Carrie has a following beyond country music that she can’t ignore or maybe her label won’t let her ignore which I think she did with Carnival Ride.

  55. Jon
    September 3, 2009 at 9:11 pm

    “Spazzing out” isn’t the kind of language I would expect from someone who so regularly chastizes others for referring to young women as “girls,” Stormy.

    Honestly, I don’t think much of this record, but neither do I think much of a single review that spends more time offering up thoughts and advice on how the artist who make it is or should be “positioned” for her career than it does actually talking about the record. It reads more like a poorly executed Music Marketing 101 essay than a review.

  56. Razor X
    September 3, 2009 at 9:11 pm

    What happened to Miranda’s single at radio is irrelevant. Radio will play Carrie’s music no matter what she releases; the same does not hold true for Miranda. Carrie doesn’t need to record crap like this to grab attention. She is in the somewhat unique position of being able to release something worthwhile without sacrificing radio airplay. With this release, she’s confirmed what some of us have known all along — that she is artistically bankrupt.

  57. Noeller
    September 3, 2009 at 9:12 pm

    I despised this song right from the opening “Man I Feel Like A Woman” guitar chords. Did Mutt produce this?? It’s pure tripe and we, as listeners, deserve better. Until we stand up and say “No, I’m not going to accept mediocrity” then this is what they’re going to continue to jam down our throats.

    Blech.

  58. Jon
    September 3, 2009 at 9:20 pm

    “Radio will play Carrie’s music no matter what she releases…”

    The history of music is littered with the remains of the careers of artists who thought that radio would play their music no matter what they released.

  59. Johnny Paycheck
    September 3, 2009 at 9:24 pm

    Noeller, unfortunately most of what comprises the music audience today is a nation full of mediocrity and people willing to settle for less than the best in everything, from morals to government to education to music. So Carrie and other mainstream artists in country as well as pop, rock and hip-hop get away with having “big” voices and very small songs, as far as content or purpose. As long as she is lauded and rewarded commercially and in awards shows for stuff like this, there is nothing to encourage her to dig deeper, or perhaps she is this shallow and there is no nothing to dig for

  60. Rick
    September 3, 2009 at 9:26 pm

    Noeller, If Carrie’s fans didn’t like tripe and mediocrity, they wouldn’t be Carrie’s fans in the first place! In comparison, I don’t care for Miranda Lambert’s style of music but I’m not going to ever deny her talent.

    I hear Carrie wanted to do a personalized version of the Shania song you mentioned, but the lyrical syncopation just didn’t work out when the chorus got changed to “Man, I Feel Like a Cardboard Cut-Out Stand-Up”….

  61. Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 9:28 pm

    Jon: Spazzing out is the phrase I would use after it was scrubbed by the PG Machine a couple of times.

  62. Rob
    September 3, 2009 at 9:28 pm

    You. Suck!

  63. Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 9:30 pm

    Johnny: To join my hobby simply send your 100.00 membership fee to Stormy’s Retirement Fund.

  64. Johnny Paycheck
    September 3, 2009 at 9:35 pm

    Stormy, after I get my part from the class action settlement from country radio for killing country music

    disclaimer^class action settlement above being a joke

  65. Jon
    September 3, 2009 at 9:40 pm

    “Jon: Spazzing out is the phrase I would use after it was scrubbed by the PG Machine a couple of times.”

    Nice excuse; I’m sure those with neuro-physical disorders will appreciate it.

  66. Johnny Paycheck
    September 3, 2009 at 9:56 pm

    I wonder why it is there always seems to be way more comments on minimal efforts like this song than on blog entries about actual country music songs and artists. Some of the stories and reviews of songs much better than this have less than 10 comments.

  67. Steve Harvey
    September 3, 2009 at 9:58 pm

    Does this song remind anyone else of this tune: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zGKu8BYe5g ?

    I think it’s one of Underwood’s better vocals though. No shrieking.

  68. Nicolas
    September 3, 2009 at 10:09 pm

    This song wasn’t produced by Mutt Lange, it was produced by Mark Bright

  69. Stormy
    September 3, 2009 at 10:10 pm

    Jon: Its also the reason I have not come up with a response for Rob that involves a joke about you tube.

  70. Razor X
    September 3, 2009 at 10:40 pm

    The history of music is littered with the remains of the careers of artists who thought that radio would play their music no matter what they released.

    Thanks for giving us some hope to cling to.

  71. Jim Malec
    September 3, 2009 at 11:13 pm

    The history of music is littered with the remains of the careers of artists who thought that radio would play their music no matter what they released.

    Few of those, however, were the most powerful players in the game at the height of their popularity.

  72. Vance
    September 3, 2009 at 11:23 pm

    Carrie really should record better material. This song is just not good. Since she is at her peak, she could probably record anything except songs that are as traditional as George Strait and Alan Jackson tunes. Cowboy Casanova is just utterly inferior to Before He Cheats.

  73. Susan
    September 3, 2009 at 11:39 pm

    I really like Carrie. I really don’t like this song at all.

  74. Joe
    September 3, 2009 at 11:59 pm

    No surprise it’s been nearly 12 hours and already there are over 70 comments here.

    My first thought upon hearing the song: I don’t like it.

    But I’ll hear it every hour on the radio between now and … the next single from Carrie Underwood so I’d better get to liking it soon.

    I entirely agree that she’s treading some very familiar territory, what with “Before He Cheats,” (that other one), and now this all complaining about some guy.

    To my knowledge, everyone agreed Carrie can sing but we’ve only received dubious evidence (particularly here) that she can write. And for that matter, despite the humble, pretty girl we see on TV all the time, we’ve little evidence she’s all that bright.

  75. Joe
    September 4, 2009 at 12:10 am

    And I agree, Carrie has still not quite reached her peak so this release will be historically dumped in a category where we’d also find “I Like It, I Love It” and not, say, “High Lonesome Sound” and everything that came after, or anything Martina’s released after that album of classics.

  76. Phil
    September 4, 2009 at 2:13 am

    I couldn’t agree with this review more. Today the artists are being created by the industry rather than creating themselves. It’s all image and personality over substance and creativity. I’m tired of hearing all the personal lives and problems of today’s artists. To me, Carrie Underwood and Taylor Swift are nothing more than marketing tools used by the industry to create a popularity contest and bring in a larger demographic, and at the same time this builds up the male Country artists fanbases since they get all the radio play, while making it impossible for aspiring female singers to succeed who might have something more to offer as “artists” since it seems like many of them are taking bad advice and trying to bank off of Carrie’s and Taylor’s success by copying it, which is fool hardy. One only has to look at the business model of Country music to figure that out. As far as the song goes…how many different ways can female Country Artists find to say the same thing over and over again about the same topic?
    Anyway, I’m sure the purpose of this song is to get both Pop and Country Radio to play it, which will ensure a wider audience buys her album…since today the mainstream music industry is more concerned about quarterly profits and Wall Street than actual music. Let’s just say I was expecting something a little more substantive and creative than this song delivered. And I don’t believe in Candy Coated anything…especially not misery, which is what this song is. I hope that wasn’t too harsh. I’m sure her album will be better. Even if I won’t be buying it…I’m sure millions who love Carrie as a person (rather than as an artist) will, even if they don’t know her personally.

  77. Tom
    September 4, 2009 at 3:08 am

    the good news is that she can sing almost anything with that voice of hers – the bad news: she actually does it.

  78. Aljid
    September 4, 2009 at 3:11 am

    Carrie sucks. She should write songs about teen love gone bad and sing horribly, live. At least she’s gonna have something to say and Jim will finally shut his mouth.

  79. Baron Lane
    September 4, 2009 at 5:46 am

    wow, there has already been more thought given to this one review for one song then was given to the song itself! Props to Jim for a thoughtful, and apparently courageous, review of piece of pop-country piffle.

  80. Hoangalicious
    September 4, 2009 at 5:50 am

    Damn u 9513
    WHy does every single Carrie has released so far receive a THUMB DOWN
    Let me tell u sth
    U like a kinda country music that Taylor Swift sing right?
    ITS NOT COUNTRY MUSIC

    COWBOY CASANOVA has a strong message
    ITS NOT REALLY SENSELESS AS U SAID
    And im telling u
    there r so many stupid songs with stupid lyrics out there
    This song has strong vocal performance

    And to ALJID: SHE’s not a teenager so she doesnt sing about teen love gone bad like Taylor does
    If u like that kida music, find taylor
    and look who will win Grammyu

    Damn you 9513
    next time find a better thing to say ( or what u call a REVIEW)

  81. Aljid
    September 4, 2009 at 5:56 am

    To Hoangalicious: It was a very sarcastic comment. I’m sorry you didn’t get it. I’ve always been supportive of Carrie. Jim Malec has always favored Swift because she’s got something to say even though she is a crappy singer. :)

  82. Vicki
    September 4, 2009 at 6:08 am

    Just read that Carrie had to release this a week earlier as some hot unfinished versions got leaked. But she is still “finishing” up her album. Wouldn’t it be nice if she read this review and others and she ‘tweaked” this song before inclusion on the finished album?

  83. Jack
    September 4, 2009 at 6:42 am

    I get a kick out of hearing all the moaning going on here about the “death of country”. Hog wash. If you don’t like the direction country music is taking then DON’T LISTEN TO IT! Please go away to some other genre somewhere and quit the constant bitching! The tiny violin I hear weaping for you is barely audible anymore.

  84. Stormy
    September 4, 2009 at 6:45 am

    Hoangalicious: Carrie and Taylor make the same kind of not country music. There is about 1/2 a degree of seperation between them.
    This is the god kind of country:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmOCAJH9OI0

  85. Stormy
    September 4, 2009 at 6:46 am

    Good kind of country.

  86. Stormy
    September 4, 2009 at 6:47 am

    As for who will win the Grammy, that will probably be Alison Krause.

  87. Tom
    September 4, 2009 at 7:16 am

    too much christian music countdown lately, stormy – or just a wink to dr. freud?

  88. Jon
    September 4, 2009 at 7:57 am

    “”The history of music is littered with the remains of the careers of artists who thought that radio would play their music no matter what they released”

    Few of those, however, were the most powerful players in the game at the height of their popularity.”

    All right, maybe “remains” is a little strong, but there are myriad instances of radio *not* playing releases from enormously popular artists. Charley Pride’s airplay fell off the table when he released “Missin’ Mississippi” after a 16+ year virtually unbroken string of Top 10 singles (most of them #1s), and basically never came back. Even at the height of his popularity, Willie Nelson released singles that tanked. Faith Hill and Lee Ann Womack both sent stuff to radio that didn’t get played, even though it came on the heels of ultra-mega-smash hits. And so on, and I haven’t even mentioned Chris Gaines ;-). Plus which, it’s purely speculative, which is generally a bad sort of criticism, and it lies in the “should have” territory, where the maker’s experience – or lack thereof – in country radio programming or promotions starts to become relevant.

  89. Stormy Lewis
    September 4, 2009 at 8:02 am

    Freud and lack of coffee.

  90. Leeann Ward
    September 4, 2009 at 8:43 am

    Phil said: “As far as the song goes…how many different ways can female Country Artists find to say the same thing over and over again about the same topic?”

    Guess you could ask the same question about the opposite gender as well.

    Joe said: “And for that matter, despite the humble, pretty girl we see on TV all the time, we’ve little evidence she’s all that bright.”

    And there’s no evidence that Carrie Underwood is not all that bright either. In fact, her four-year college degree may even prove otherwise, though such accusations of lack of “brightness” are kind of tasteless anyway.

  91. waynoe
    September 4, 2009 at 8:47 am

    What I notice about this self-anointed know-it-all blog is the universal thumbs down for anything released by a mainstream artist. Now don’t misunderstand, I am not a fan of pop-country. Yes I put it in the right order.

    But it seems every alternative (alt-country) artist gets thumbs up and mainstream artists get thumbs down. Why don’t you just say this is an alt-country website?

  92. Jim Malec
    September 4, 2009 at 8:48 am

    @JON

    There’s a difference between being enormously popular and being a pop culture touchstone.

    Charley Pride was never country music’s biggest star, and he was never the focal point of the radio format. He was enormously popular, of course, but by the time “Missin’ Mississippi” was released, it had been 18 years since he charted his first top 10 hit.

    That single of course, began his eventual disappearance from the charts altogether, but his career at that point is incomparable to Underwood’s at this point.

    Not to mention that Pride’s disappearance from the chart was not an isolated incident; Waylon Jennings’ chart run ended in 1987. Merle Haggard’s effectively ended in 1987. Willie Nelson never hit the top 10 after 1989. There was a changing of the guard happening in country music during the 1980s. These artists had been making hits for years, but the format had to either change or die as its core artists became senior citizens.

    Underwood is at a very different place, and because of that she has far more flexibility when sending a song to radio than Pride did in 1984. The tides were already starting to turn against Pride, and if it wasn’t “Missin’ Mississippi” it would have been another song.

    Further, country radio of today is far different than Pride’s and Nelson’s; it’s more uniform, narrow and ubiquitous. Omitting a Charley Pride song from your playlist, in 1984, doesn’t have the same commercial ramifications that omitting a Carrie Underwood song from your playlist has in 2009. Underwood is the format’s single most important driving force.

    Faith Hill, of course, had immeasurable success for an extended period–during the first 10 years of her career, 19 of her 20 released singles charted #12 or better. Can you compare Hill (who never had the platform appeal of American Idol), after 10 years in the business, to Underwood after 4? No. Was Faith Hill, in 1997 (4 years after her debut), the biggest star in country music (like Underwood is)? No.

    As for Lee Ann Womack, she never had anywhere close to the chart success of Underwood. The fact that radio didn’t play some of her songs isn’t surprising–she never mattered that much to radio, her brand of country a tough sell at the point when her career emerged.

  93. Razor X
    September 4, 2009 at 8:54 am

    @Waynoe, so do Kellie Pickler, Josh Turner, Lady Antebellum and the Zac Brown Band qualify as alt-country artists? Because their latest singles all received a “thumbs up” from The 9513.

  94. Jim Malec
    September 4, 2009 at 8:55 am
  95. Tara Seetharam
    September 4, 2009 at 8:57 am

    Question for the comments who are also writers/bloggers: all joking aside, clearly you understand that there is a population of intelligent, rational Carrie Underwood fans who are knowledgeable about country music. Whether you’re making or endorsing comments like:

    “Oh Jim, why did you have to go and wake the Carrie Fanbots from their typically dormant mental state…”

    “Noeller, If Carrie’s fans didn’t like tripe and mediocrity, they wouldn’t be Carrie’s fans in the first place!”

    …you’re alienating a chunk of readers. The implication is that you feel you don’t need those readers…and I think that’s about as narrow-minded as those pop-country fans, the ones you so despise, who don’t know anything beyond pop-country.

  96. Paul W Dennis
    September 4, 2009 at 9:24 am

    “Charley Pride was never country music’s biggest star, and he was never the focal point of the radio format. He was enormously popular, of course, but by the time “Missin’ Mississippi” was released, it had been 18 years since he charted his first top 10 hit.”

    I usually agree with you Jim, but here I must take issue – for a few years 1972-1975 Charley Pride arguably WAS the biggest star in country music and radio played his music constantly – even his album tracks received some airplay. Several of his albums went Gold and charted on the all-format album charts at a time when few country acts were charting on those charts – if Billboard had Soundscan in place at the time Charley would have had several of his albums reach the all-genre top five.

    Yes, Cash, Twitty & Haggard were the leading top competitors around but none were as consistantly at the top as Charley Pride. Twitty’s albums never sold as well; Haggard albums normally didn’t sell as well; and while Cash’s album sales were often in Pride’s ballpark issued had singles that didn’t do nearly as well. For a few years everything Pride touched topped the charts

  97. Paul W Dennis
    September 4, 2009 at 9:30 am

    Tara – the readers you risk alienating are those readers who are already alienated by the fact that you didn’t write a glowing review about their current favorite. They’ll be back to vent again, every time a new review is written, in order to prove their fandom and maintain their street cred.

    The rest of the readers are savvy enough to recognize tongue-in-cheek comments when they are made. If they are not savvy enough, it’s about time they learned !

  98. Phil
    September 4, 2009 at 11:27 am

    Phil said: “As far as the song goes…how many different ways can female Country Artists find to say the same thing over and over again about the same topic?”

    Leeann Ward said: Guess you could ask the same question about the opposite gender as well.

    Yes…agreed. But I think Country Music and the themes are set up more favorably for male singers. I mean, I don’t think many female Country Artists would have much success singing about Big Green Tractors or how much they love NASCAR and mustard on their fries.

    Anyway…anybody who knows anything about Enneagram personality types, knows we are basically just living in a dysfunctional Type 3 society where personality trumps art and creativity. Hence, we get stuck listening to songs like Carrie’s released to radio by today’s Artists…both male and female.
    http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/Typethreeoverview.asp

  99. Tara Seetharam
    September 4, 2009 at 11:28 am

    I’d say some of those comments are a bit more malicious than tongue-in-cheek comments. But, agree to disagree.

  100. TexasVet
    September 4, 2009 at 11:53 am

    After releasing two ballads in a row I’m not surprised that she chose a more up tempo tune to start her “Drive On” era. I’m not crazy about Cowboy Casanova but won’t change stations either. Hopefully “Oklahoma Wind” a song she co-wrote with Bill Anderson made the album and will be released as a single.

  101. TexasVet
    September 4, 2009 at 11:54 am

    “Drive On” Oops, I meant Play On! LOL!

  102. Stormy Lewis
    September 4, 2009 at 12:31 pm

    Maybe Carrie released this song just to see if she could release a truely awful piece of crap and still have her fans defend it?

  103. TexasVet
    September 4, 2009 at 12:38 pm

    Isn’t one Stormy enough? LOL!

  104. Razor X
    September 4, 2009 at 12:41 pm

    Maybe Carrie released this song just to see if she could release a truely awful piece of crap and still have her fans defend it?

    Hasn’t she pretty much been doing that her entire career?

  105. Jon
    September 4, 2009 at 12:42 pm

    Jim, I don’t know that defending an overblown statement by dishing out a couple of even more overblown ones is a sensible strategy, especially when they contain contradictory elements. You really think that Carrie Underwood is a pop culture touchstone when, as you point out later, she’s only been around for four years? I’m almost as skeptical of that one as I am of the original proposition – namely, that she can release whatever she wants to country radio and it will be a hit. Or the one about how she’s country radio’s “single most important driving force.”

    Those are the points I’m going to keep my focus on. To begin with, the first of those, while having the form of a factual statement, is speculative. Furthermore, whatever the individual reasons are for them, there are plenty of counter-examples, some of which I listed – and it’s in trying to dismiss them as inappicable that you get more overblown. What reason is there to think that Carrie Underwood’s position with respect to country radio is qualitatively different than Faith Hill’s was? Same question goes for Garth’s. As for Pride, Paul has already pointed out that you’re wrong (managing, BTW, to compress half the decade into what might be taken as a matter of months) . Then there were the Dixie Chicks; country radio pulled the plug on them despite the fact that not only were they huge in general there, but they had a top single on the charts at that very moment – and the particular reason for the move is secondary to the point that a decisive number of programmers didn’t hesitate to do it.

    It’s worth noting that if your statement that Underwood is country radio’s “single most important driving force” – and that’s the reason you offer for its purported willingness to air whatever she sends – is true, it’s become so only in the last few months, because the Edison Research study commissioned by the CRB that was presented at this year’s CRS was based on surveys done between January and March of this year, and it shows Underwood as just one of a group of about 10 top artists; her numbers look pretty much identical to those of Rascal Flatts and Tim McGraw, and lower than that of Paisley, Strait, Jackson and a couple of others. She’s pretty much the top female artist at country radio, but that’s not the same thing as being its “single most important driving force.” Indeed, it’s more plausible to think that there is no one who fits that description.

    Now, if you’ve got something concrete to support your proposition, I’d like to see it. The odd part is that while this “she shoulda done something else – something I’d like better – because they’d play it no matter what” isn’t really an integral, much less essential piece of the review. In fact, it’s the weakest point, especially because it starts to get onto the territory where folks can reasonably ask about your own experience and track record at country radio. You’ve posited in the past that artists should take critics’ artistic advice into account when making their records; are you now adding business advice to the list? What’s the difference between a critic and a manager, then – other than that one has to actually deliver?

  106. JD
    September 4, 2009 at 1:36 pm

    Why am I having a M*A*S*H flashback….. Major Winchester…..

  107. sam (sam the drywall man)
    September 4, 2009 at 1:45 pm

    I just wanted to write to say that I enjoy reading Jon’s comments because he brings a higher level of intellect to the discussion. I hope he will continue to comment more in the future.

  108. Stormy Lewis
    September 4, 2009 at 2:00 pm

    Sam: A higher level of pretention does not mean a higher level of intellect.

  109. Jack
    September 4, 2009 at 2:07 pm

    Jim says: “Underwood is the format’s single most important driving force.” My observation: In what universe do you live? I don’t know how you come up with this, clearly Taylor is now the reigning queen of country radio and one of the top rulers of mainstream pop radio also. There is no comparison, not in records sold or in seats filled or in radio airplay. Carrie’s only radio airplay outside of country radio is for BHC, and that is pretty low down the list these days. I don’t see how Carrie drives country radio any more than other top artists like Rascall Flatts or Sugarland or Kenny or Brad etc. etc. etc. And Taylor dominates them all right now.

  110. Kelly
    September 4, 2009 at 2:18 pm

    Hey everyone – Jon changed his name to Sam.

  111. Jim Malec
    September 4, 2009 at 2:18 pm

    Jim, I don’t know that defending an overblown statement by dishing out a couple of even more overblown ones is a sensible strategy,

    Who here loves empty criticisms? If you’re going to call something overblown, you should at least make an effort to explain why you think so–otherwise it just makes you look like an elitist.

    especially when they contain contradictory elements. You really think that Carrie Underwood is a pop culture touchstone when, as you point out later, she’s only been around for four years?

    Carrie Underwood is a pop culture touchstone. If you don’t realize that, you’re even more out of touch with what’s going on outside your very narrow niche than I imagined.

    It’s only “speculative” if you take it as something that’s meant to be “true” or something that’s meant to be “fact.” In reality, you’re the only person out of thousands of readers who has a problem with my statement. So, are you really the only person reading this who is smart enough to see my flawed logic?

    Maybe, just maybe, you’re the only person reading this who is dense enough not to understand why I referenced the “Itsy Bitsy Spider.” It goes without saying–or it should go without saying–that country radio would not play a song about a small arachnid, nor would it play a song about a piping hot pile of cow poop, nor would it play a song about a pretentious bluegrass musician and former radio guy who has a limited ability to respectfully interact with people in possession of differing viewpoints.

    Furthermore, whatever the individual reasons are for them, there are plenty of counter-examples, some of which I listed – and it’s in trying to dismiss them as inappicable that you get more overblown. What reason is there to think that Carrie Underwood’s position with respect to country radio is qualitatively different than Faith Hill’s was?

    I think I discussed that quite a bit in my previous reply to you, and so I’m not going to defend a position here that you choose not even to acknowledge.

    Reasons matter.

    Same question goes for Garth’s.

    Chris Gaines is a project apart, and not even worth discussing in this thread.

    As for Pride, Paul has already pointed out that you’re wrong (managing, BTW, to compress half the decade into what might be taken as a matter of months).

    Paul didn’t point out that I was “wrong.” He pointed out that he disagreed. Can you tell me that every person who is educated about, and who has studied and worked in, country music, would say that at one point Charley Pride was the genre’s biggest star? Could you say that? Are you willing to stand by that enormous claim?

    Then there were the Dixie Chicks; country radio pulled the plug on them despite the fact that not only were they huge in general there, but they had a top single on the charts at that very moment – and the particular reason for the move is secondary to the point that a decisive number of programmers didn’t hesitate to do it.

    That country radio pulled the plug on the Chicks had nothing to do with their music–and music has everything to do with what we’re talking about. C’mon, Jon, you’re grasping at straws here. That’s a terrible example.

    It’s worth noting that if your statement that Underwood is country radio’s “single most important driving force” – and that’s the reason you offer for its purported willingness to air whatever she sends – is true, it’s become so only in the last few months, because the Edison Research study commissioned by the CRB that was presented at this year’s CRS was based on surveys done between January and March of this year, and it shows Underwood as just one of a group of about 10 top artists; her numbers look pretty much identical to those of Rascal Flatts and Tim McGraw, and lower than that of Paisley, Strait, Jackson and a couple of others.

    I think Carrie Underwood is country radio’s most important driving force because her music sets the tone of the format. This is opinion. Brad Paisley, Toby Keith and George Strait have deep-seeded fan bases, and score well in survey-based research. But there’s nothing particularly “driving” about their music. Toby Keith doesn’t expand the audience. Brad Paisley doesn’t change the musical formula (he’s been doing the same gig for X years).

    And while artists like that are bound to score better in terms of likability, I think you’d be hard-pressed to find people who would call them the future of the format. Between Brad Paisley and Carrie Underwood, which one is more important when it comes to “driving” the format, ESPECIALLY as related to expanding the audience?

    Indeed, it’s more plausible to think that there is no one who fits that description.

    You’re welcome to that opinion. I’m sure some would share it, and I’m sure you could make a great argument about it. Hopefully, you publish an editorial on it somewhere so that we can all read your insights.

    You’ve posited in the past that artists should take critics’ artistic advice into account when making their records

    Excuse me? Can you provide an example of that? I don’t remember making that claim, and I have a feeling that it was probably taken out of context (if I made any statement even semi-related to that). If you’re going to throw stuff like that out into the air, you should have the source material without being asked.

    Are you now adding business advice to the list? What’s the difference between a critic and a manager, then – other than that one has to actually deliver?

    Now this we can agree on. I definitely think artists should take my business advice. I also think managers and label executives should take my business advice. Especially since I have both an education in music business and practical experience from the creative side.

  112. Jim Malec
    September 4, 2009 at 2:24 pm

    @Jack:

    I just think the jury is out on what Swift means to country music. She seems to exist as an entity apart, in my opinion; neither beholden to the format nor independent of it.

  113. Steve from Boston
    September 4, 2009 at 2:28 pm

    Johnny Paycheck said: “……. So Carrie and other mainstream artists in country as well as pop, rock and hip-hop get away with having “big” voices and very small songs, as far as content or purpose. As long as she is lauded and rewarded commercially and in awards shows for stuff like this, there is nothing to encourage her to dig deeper, or perhaps she is this shallow and there is no nothing to dig for”

    Johnny, I’m beginning to suspect the latter, or as Razor put it: “With this release, she’s confirmed what some of us have known all along — that she is artistically bankrupt.”

    What bugs me the most is this kind of plasti-crap being called “Country” …If Carrie were just a minor player, it wouldn’t be as much of an issue with many of us…But I resent that good quality genunie COUNTRY artists are being forced out to the fringes to make room for this kind of “stuff”.

    Her voice sounds electronically altered ( a production choice for stylistic purposes vs pitch correction, perhaps) She has a bit of that Paula Abdul electronic timbre to her voice in this one…

    The thumping dance beat has no root in real Counry, quite the opposite…this is the antithesis of good Country music.

    I’m beginning to think that Carrie’s token nods to the Opry and Country’s finest traditions are just that, token nods vs any real indication of where her musical heart resides…

  114. Matt B.
    September 4, 2009 at 2:46 pm

    Brad Paisley doesn’t change the musical formula (he’s been doing the same gig for X years).

    While this may have been true before, he has expanded his ‘formula’ on his latest record.

  115. mike
    September 4, 2009 at 3:03 pm

    i love how dedicated carrie fans are :D
    loved the song BTW so who cares what the review says

  116. Razor X
    September 4, 2009 at 3:10 pm

    …loved the song BTW so who cares what the review says

    A lot of people, apparently, based on the number of comments generated.

  117. Wade
    September 4, 2009 at 3:22 pm

    “Johnny, I’m beginning to suspect the latter, or as Razor put it: “With this release, she’s confirmed what some of us have known all along — that she is artistically bankrupt.””

    Steve, i couldnt agree with you more. I really dont care for Carrie, but she can do much better than this piece of crap. Its like a rejected Shania pop-dance song (as others have mentioned). How this got positive reviews anywhere is beyond me. Also, this song getting played on the radio confirms my belief that radio will play anything and that Carries fans will support anything no matter how horrible.

    The part that worries me more is the fact that this is her “writing”. If this is her writing then GOD HELP US, and the producer should be run out of Nashville. If this is her paying people to write for her than why the hell would she pick this to release, much less put on the album.

    I just dont think she can sell the songs shes singing. Thats my biggest problem with her, Gretchen Wilson mentioned how Carrie (well she beat around the bush but thats what she meant) was the downfall of our genre. The Carrie fans defense: tear Gretchen(oh and this guy named Merle Haggard too) a new one and say how Gretchen doesnt “write” songs about her life, maybe not, but she picks songs she can sing and that you believe coming from her. I dont believe that Carrie had a drunken one night stand in Vegas, but i can see Gretchen with a kid on her hip standing in front of her trailer. (God Bless America for people who should actually be allowed to sing country music.) Also im not talking bad about Gretchen and how she lives/ things she sings about. The town that i live in is country as can be, and im proud to call it home.

    To top everything off, Carrie, well Sony/ the producer/ the writers stole the music/beat from “Bang” by Brittany McDonald (Go look, its on her myspace…. for now). No need to fear though Brittany immediately removed her tweet about it being “similar” and Sony snatched the Side by Side comparison video off youtube.. Brittany is probably a rich person now, but at what cost..

    Finally, about Taylor Swift.. She is the Queen of “Country” music (much to my dismay), and theres not much anyone can do about it right now it seems. I think she has potential, if she would just mature a little in her songwriting topics, and sing songs that she can stay in pitch on, she might can be decent.

    Ok i think thats it.. haha

  118. wilS
    September 4, 2009 at 3:28 pm

    would this matter this much if maybe shania twain released this??

  119. Stormy Lewis
    September 4, 2009 at 3:43 pm

    No one expects good songs from Shania.

  120. M.C.
    September 4, 2009 at 3:59 pm

    @Stormy: No one expects good songs from Shania.

    …because everyone in the world has exactly your tastes, right?

  121. Baron Lane
    September 4, 2009 at 4:08 pm

    Stormy “god kind of country” Lordy me Stormy, isn’t this discussion heated enough as is? ;)

  122. Vicki
    September 4, 2009 at 4:13 pm

    Texasvet you have it right. I think she released this to counter her last song “I Told You So”. She probably felt she needed something up temple and more pop like to keep her more pop fans from Idol. Swift has by far the vast majority of teen fans but Carrie still has plenty and I see many who love them both. So with this “got a good beat to dance to but nothing in lyrics” song, she keeps her pop fans. I think you are right, next one up will be a counter to this ..probably “Oklahoma Wind”. How long can she try to straddle the fence?

  123. Stormy Lewis
    September 4, 2009 at 4:17 pm

    mc: No, because she actually wrote a song with the line “even my skin is asking weird/I wish that I could grow a beard.”

  124. hannah
    September 4, 2009 at 4:20 pm

    im a fan of both underwood and swift
    i loved the demo of oklahoma wind.. just wish she records it, but i doubt jim will like that either.
    bet he already has figured out how to prove Oklahoma Wind a “not country” song
    and why does she need to be either country or pop…why cant she be both??? we already know shez good at it.

  125. Jon
    September 4, 2009 at 4:23 pm

    Yes, Jim, overblown. The original statement that I responded to was overblown (““Radio will play Carrie’s music no matter what she releases…”), and so are things like calling Underwood a “pop culture touchstone”; offering the one as support for the other just ups the rhetorical level.

    You may think you discussed why Carrie Underwood’s position with respect to country radio is qualitatively different than Faith Hill’s was when she released Cry, but in actuality, all you did was to count up some number of Hill’s hits, then make a claim that yes, her position’s qualitatively different, cast in the form of a couple of rhetorical questions – while, in the meantime, overlooking the salient point, which is that, though she was huge at the time, when Hill sent stuff to country radio that programmers didn’t like, her airplay plummeted. And that’s the point under discussion – or, at least, the point I’m trying to discuss. You seem to think that if you say “it’s different” six or seven times in six or seven different ways – with respect to Hill, and Garth Brooks, and the Dixie Chicks, and Charley Pride – you’ve shown how it’s different, though in the one case (Pride) where you seem to have made a serious stab at doing so, you’ve just been plain off the mark. Pride’s precipitous slide from the top of the charts wasn’t part of the “changing of the guard” that led to the disappearance of many others of his generation; that took place a few years later and, if you actually look at the chart histories, had a rather different shape. And the salient point here (again) is that for a long time he was at the top of the charts, a proven favorite – and even so, country radio dropped his records when it didn’t like them.

    “I think that Carrie Underwood is country radio’s most important driving force because her music sets the tone of the format. This is opinion….While artists like [Paisley, Keith & Strait] are bound to score better in terms of likability, I think you’d be hard-pressed to find people who would call them the future of the format.”

    Oddly enough, it’s easier to find people – at least via Google – who call Paisley “the future of country music” than it is to find people who say the same about Underwood. Try Chris Willman (“Welcome to the future of country music: For now, it’s still named Brad Paisley.”) and the Boston Globe’s James Reed (“Welcome to the future . . . of country music.”) for two recent examples. FWIW, I disagree with them, too, for the same reason I disagree with you about Underwood being country radio’s “single most important driving force,” but the point here is that saying it’s “because her music sets the tone of the format” isn’t offering support for the opinion, it’s just saying the same thing with different words; there’s no “because” about it.

    Underwood’s doubtless an important artist, and I’m sure that programmers would think long and hard about taking a pass on one of her records, but that doesn’t mean 1) that they wouldn’t do so if they didn’t think that it fit the format, or 2) that they wouldn’t also think long and hard about taking a pass on records sent by any of another half-dozen to dozen artists. Any artist who thinks that they can push something past radio’s gatekeepers and onto the air – whether it’s something that you or Razor X or me or the artist him/herself thinks is great or awful – is taking a risk.

    “”You’ve posited in the past that artists should take critics’ artistic advice into account when making their records.”"
    “Excuse me? Can you provide an example of that?”

    I’ll gladly do so just as soon as The9513′s search engine extends to comments, and not just to original content, because that’s where you dished up your ruminations on the role of The Critic.

    “I definitely think artists should take my business advice. I also think managers and label executives should take my business advice. especially since I have both an education in music business and practical experience from the creative side.”

    Now that’s funny!

    Every record sent to country radio is a risk to one degree or another (and I’m not talking about “Itsy Bitsy Spider”), and it doesn’t take a music business education to know that. All you need to do is look at the history of country radio.

  126. hannah
    September 4, 2009 at 4:26 pm

    i am a fan of both underwood and swift
    i too wish underwoods next single is Oklahoma Wind, because i loved the demo of that song. i bet these people have already figured out a way to prove that its a “not country” song too.
    and why should she be either country of pop???why cant she be both? we already know she is good at it

  127. kevin w
    September 4, 2009 at 4:28 pm

    I just want to say this thread is just funny. From both sides. Some of these comments……

  128. dave
    September 4, 2009 at 4:31 pm

    did you guys see ho beautiful she looks on that album cover???

  129. Stormy
    September 4, 2009 at 7:06 pm

    Hannah: No one saying that Carrie an’t make country and pop. The problems are:
    1. This is really bad.
    2. She is not calling this pop.

  130. Stephen
    September 4, 2009 at 7:35 pm

    Stormy, this is bad in your opinion. To others, it’s great. That’s why it’s funny that you and some fellow commenters on this site make it seem like country radio is idiotic for playing this – obviously not since people like it.

    Get over yourselves, your tastes aren’t the only ones in this world (no matter how much you wish they were).

  131. Jan
    September 4, 2009 at 7:57 pm

    Actually, this all makes me sick to my stomach….a bunch of psudo-intellects being jerks. I hate this site.

  132. Rick
    September 4, 2009 at 8:28 pm

    Jan said: “Actually, this all makes me sick to my stomach…a bunch of pseudo-intellects being jerks. I hate this site.” That describes exactly how I feel about the Daily Leftist Kause, Up-Chuckington Post, and listening to NPR (excluding “A Prairie Home Companion”)! Well said! (lol)

    Both Carrie and Taylor are pop culture icon/touchstones at the moment who happen to call Top 40 country radio home. Carrie built her substantial pop-culture fan base on American Idol and has expanded it from there. Taylor tapped into the Disney Channel / Nickelodeon young female audience of Hannah Montana and the Jonas Brothers. I don’t consider either of these pop divas to have any real country cred even if they currently dominate the “mainstream country” landscape. At least Shania started out as a real country artist…

  133. Chris N.
    September 4, 2009 at 8:45 pm

    What the hell? So Rick shops at Whole Foods AND listens to Garrison Keillor? What is going on here?

  134. Stormy
    September 4, 2009 at 9:27 pm

    Obviously, I am a good influence. I’ll have him voting Green Party by next election–just watch me.

  135. Stormy
    September 4, 2009 at 9:28 pm

    Stephen: I haven’t said anything about country radio playing this. Country radio will play the hell out of the percisely because it is crap.

  136. TenPoundHammer
    September 4, 2009 at 10:46 pm

    Wow. Just because this is a negative review, the fanboys keep excising it from the Wikipedia article. Whitewash much?

  137. TexasVet
    September 4, 2009 at 10:55 pm
  138. Saving Country Music
    September 4, 2009 at 11:16 pm

    I stand up and slow clap for you Jim, for having the courage to stand up and speak the truth.

    Not only about how this song is soul-less, but also about how Carrie Underwood is a very talented individual, who is wasting it on rubbish songs molded in the Nashville machine.

    One day far in the future when Carrie Underwood is on her death bed, I doubt she will look back and regret she didn’t make more money, but she might look back and regret she squandered her talents on making so much of it.

  139. suzanne
    September 5, 2009 at 12:41 am

    come on the song is not “dead weight” or “soul less”. it is far from that. as you have already said this will be a mega hit and it would not be so if it werent a good song even if carrie underwood released it. why would people listen to bad songs??i know i wouldnt.
    every song she has ever released has gone to no.1 or 2 because the songs were good and because she DID NOT release “itsy bitsy spiders” as singles.
    there is no reason for her to regret making this song to make some money because there is an entire album remaining where she could put her more “artistic” tracks as some of you put it. just listen to Oklahoma Wind..if that is on the album you cannot get more artistic than that!
    i would put this song in the album if it were me too because as you have said it it will sell and there is nothing wrong with giving the material your fans want.

  140. suzanne
    September 5, 2009 at 12:43 am

    one more thing…it is country whether you like it or not!

  141. Phil
    September 5, 2009 at 1:39 am

    Haha…sometimes I wonder if this site just went away then so would Carrie and Taylor. OK…one can wish. This place just seems to fuel the “fake” competition between the two fanbases. I can’t believe people fight over which one is better…they should be fighting over which one is worse. Now that would be a good discussion. To me it’s pretty obvious the Industry created these two artists on purpose for one reason only: To bring in a wider audience and build up the fanbases of the male Country artists. If it weren’t Carrie and Taylor it would have been somebody else. Even Brad Paisley said he has new fans thanks to Taylor Swift. I doubt many female artists can say the same. All the awards and accolades they have received are just a slick coverup to make people believe they are somehow special and different from any of the artists from the past who actually used their talent as “Artists” rather than who they were as a “Person”. I will say that I think both artists have hurt Country Music in the long term more than they have ever done to help it. But the industry only has itself to blame for that. Luckily there is only room for one Carrie and one Taylor at a time in Country Music because of the business model Country Music employs. But bringing in new fans that will jump ship once Carrie and Taylor are gone is inevitible. They are loyal to Carrie and Taylor, not to Country Music. It’s such a joke. I’ll bet the Industry loves it, and actually welcomes this site. Any publicity is good publicity. It’s just too bad that they can’t see the big picture. Country Music is digging its own grave by focusing all of its publicity, promotion and attention on these two artists, and can’t see the nail in the coffin. They think these fans will still be around in 20 years and remain faithful to Country Music. I beg to differ.
    Anyway, to me Country Music today is just another version of American Idol. It’s a popularity contest where the producers cast the characters as a person and give them a role to play as the artist they want them to be. And the judges have already picked their favorites and the winners for us. And Carrie and Taylor have taken the two prime slots out of the very few that are available for solo female Country Artists. But people still continue to vote anyway. All the other contestants may as well not even bother participating.

  142. klark
    September 5, 2009 at 5:49 am

    Is this another carrie underwood shriekfest ?
    i hope this won’t be the reflection of her next album
    (i expected that this song would get a thumbs down)
    it’s on par with Last Name. nyay
    I miss the ‘Jesus take the Wheel’ and ‘Before He Cheats’ days.

  143. klark
    September 5, 2009 at 5:53 am

    another thing, is this the adult version of Taylor Swift’s ‘Fifteen’ ? :)

  144. Jack
    September 5, 2009 at 6:03 am

    Unfortunately, I’ve decided to give up on this site. The discussions here often descend into name calling and hate filled or extremist opinions whose sole point is to inflame people. It is almost impossible, therefore, to have any sort of sustained respectful exchange of views on this site. Insults do not constitute fruitful speech, and discussions on this site often consist mostly of them.

  145. klark
    September 5, 2009 at 6:31 am

    nyay..i’ll retract what i posted earlier. (shame c:)
    this ain’t at par with last name, (it’s better by a mile)
    I agree with Tony, it seems like a sequel for Before He Cheats and Last Name.
    The song is not bad, but I expected this to get a thumbs down because they don’t give sideways here
    It isn’t great too, maybe because it’s almost the same with her other previous efforts.
    (I think this will be a hit for her)
    I hope her third album will show more of her artistic side.Anyway, I am a fan of Ms. Underwood and still can’t grasp the fact that some of her songs get a thumbs down in this site yet, i respect their opinions.

  146. Martin in NY
    September 5, 2009 at 7:42 am

    Yes, Carrie has this amazing voice and is often given a free pass because of it. I think she is like the Whitney Houston or Mariah Carey of the country world. In other words, her voice is really big and powerful, but she just lacks taste. Let’s face it, she’s just not hip. She’s just not. She doesn’t have real edge, even when the concept of her songs could be seen as edgy. It’s this fake, safe image that is very marketable. This is fine if you don’t like more progressive music, but she is certainly not doing anything to move country (or pop) music forward.

  147. Callie
    September 5, 2009 at 10:18 am

    I am another who likes Jon’s posts. He may come across as “Major Winchester”, but IMO, so does Jim. Bottom line I appreciate the fact that he seems to respect the artists (whether he actually likes them or not) and he calls other posters when they make comments they have no clue about (the artists motivations, etc.). Obvious snark aside, plenty of the content here is put out there as truth rather than opinion and if Jon can make one poster/commenter think twice before posting something as gospel, then IMO, he is not only welcome, but needed to balance this blog.

  148. Mando
    September 5, 2009 at 10:33 am

    Great review Jim. IA Martin.
    The only way this song pushes limits/boundaries is on how much more “pop” the already pop-country radio can become..I really wished she would use her position in a better way.
    CU’s label will most likely release it on popstations but with this “countryversion” remixing for an alternate version won’t be necessary. In that way they also can avoid the tough questions on CU’s promise to not ever remix her songs.

  149. Jim Malec
    September 5, 2009 at 10:49 am

    The problem, Callie, isn’t Jon. The problem is the fact that some people are still clinging to the idea that the old gatekeepers should control the dissemination of information and the tone of discussion–and who gets to be a part of that.

    I appreciate any balance Jon brings to my admittedly confidently-written reviews. But my issue with Jon is that he makes it personal. Maybe that’s because he thinks I make it personal. Maybe that’s because he thinks I’m not good at what I do. Maybe he wishes he had my job. I don’t know–I’ve tried to ask him privately and he won’t tell me.

    And I respond to the constant personal attacks because they go beyond criticism of my criticism, to an extent that is actually shocking for two people who, for all intents and purposes, are peers (even though Jon isn’t currently publishing much). If Jon disagrees with my work, he should detail those disagreements without resorting to disrespectful and dismissive dialog.

    But yes, I do agree that balance is good. And I hope Jon continues to post. I just wish he’d use that excellent intellect for something other than potshots.

  150. Vicki
    September 5, 2009 at 10:55 am

    Martin..You can give your opinion about the song but I had to defend Ms. Carrie with the “fake, safe image” comment. Like her or not, what you see is what you get. She can be boringly polite, sound socially inept and sometimes speak like she didn’t get a degree in communications. But she is who she is -a good Christian girl from a 2 stoplight town in Oklahoma. I don’t think her bf Mike Fisher, who is as strong in his faith as he is a great hockey player (Dad is also a minister) would be dating her this long if she wasn’t. Safe, yes, but Fake..no.

  151. kevin w
    September 5, 2009 at 11:21 am

    “It’s this fake, safe image that is very marketable.”

    Yeah, you’re hip

  152. kevin w
    September 5, 2009 at 11:24 am

    For someone that’s safe, she sure brings out quite the reaction, as evidenced on this site. Just amazing.

  153. Stormy
    September 5, 2009 at 11:40 am

    Suzanne: Have you not heard most of the crap played on country radio these days?

  154. Janette
    September 5, 2009 at 12:15 pm

    hey Jim,
    I just wanted to say I couldn’t agree with you more on this review. It’s not meant to bash Carrie (because she IS an AMAZING singer). But I agree that the song is crap. It’s an empty shell.

  155. Rick
    September 5, 2009 at 4:57 pm

    Jim, its obvious that Jon has been looking for an intellectual sparring partner he considers up to the task, and lucky you, you’re it! You take Jon’s potshots very seriously since they are personal to you, while the rest of us think “Oh look, Jon’s going after Jim again just to stir up a verbal confrontation Jon obviously enjoys”.

    It takes two to tango and if you ignore Jon’s attacks he might be less motivated to do it on such a regular basis. Although preople ignoring me due to my political rants and general snarkiness hasn’t slowed me down any. Hmmm….

  156. SteveM.
    September 5, 2009 at 7:05 pm

    This song and and the artist represent all that is wrong in country music. Its a soulless project that is producer driven rather then artist. Its almost criminal radio plays this garbage and ignores the Allison Krause/Robert Plant album. Country radio execs have become arrogant that they can shove any crap down a gullible public’s throat.

  157. TawnyTucker
    September 5, 2009 at 8:28 pm

    I see that our website isn’t the only one who gets the “Carrie Can Do No Wrong” traffic…LMAO…

  158. Jerry
    September 5, 2009 at 9:44 pm

    Your review is perfect. What a waste of talent. How and why did she choose this song? Cowboy Casanova sounds like it’s for a soundtrack for some B-rate movie or bubblegum pop from Jessica Simpson and Britney Spears. The lyrics are very old school pop cheese. What is the junk in the background, gargoyles from Michael Jackson’s Thriller? Halloween isn’t far off. When the worst songs of 2009 lists come out this will be #1.

    This pop s*** is ruining country music and radio. It’s sad that radio will play this to death until it reaches #1 while ignoring many better songs. Sony will promote the hell out of it and they all but own radio. Carrie is very lucky to have a legion of fans that will buy this and anything she records and call it the best song in the history of country music.

    One sector of Carrie’s fans has always bragged about her refusing to remix her songs for pop radio and bashed Taylor for doing it. What do they think of Carrie recording two versions of Cowboy Casanova? One is for country radio. The other 100.7 The Wolf played is a very very pop remix with no country music and Sony could be planning to release it to pop radio to compete with Taylor.

  159. Vance
    September 5, 2009 at 10:11 pm

    The label isn’t going to release that rough track of Cowboy Casanova. Sony stated that there was no intention for it to be released. So, Carrie isn’t contradicting herself with regards to remixes but this song just sucks. As a fan, I’m very disappointed that this is the follow-up to I Told You So which I loved.

  160. J.R. Journey
    September 5, 2009 at 10:32 pm

    Rick’s comment at 4:57 = right on, buddy!

  161. Razor X
    September 5, 2009 at 11:00 pm

    I see that our website isn’t the only one who gets the “Carrie Can Do No Wrong” traffic…LMAO…

    Not by a long shot. Any website that contains comment about Carrie that are less than 300% positive will bring the Scary fans out of the woodwork in droves.

  162. Dan
    September 6, 2009 at 2:13 am

    This is yet another teriffic song sung by Carrie Underwood. This will definitely be another #1 for her and has a very good possibility of reaching “Before He Cheats” heights. All of her songs get played on the radio a lot because they are all great and she has not disappointed yet. Two Thumbs Way, Way Up for this country song and I can’t wait for her album, PLAY ON, to be released on November 3, 2009!

  163. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 2:31 am

    I think a lot of the people dissing her here are actually people who work and or have very close ties to the music industry b/c they keep mentioning her record label.. so are biased d/t their attachment to the competition or just attached to the past. Her music fans, and music fans (females, who buy the bulk of her music) will love this tune.. it’s sassy with vibe which is TOTALLY in right now… yes, the world is changing folks.. I’m sure there will be plenty of beautiful country ballads on her new CD too… Can’t wait to hear it.

  164. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 2:48 am

    btw I don’t think this song is irrelevant.. if you were once a girl in her 20′s you would understand that there will always be this guy who’s heart you can’t catch, b/c his eyes are too busy scanning the room for the next best thing.. I think if Carrie wrote this I wouldn’t doubt she is writing from experience. Every girl I know, will relate to this lyric.

  165. Razor X
    September 6, 2009 at 2:54 am

    I think a lot of the people dissing her here are actually people who work and or have very close ties to the music industry b/c they keep mentioning her record label.. so are biased d/t their attachment to the competition or just attached to the past.

    Well, there you have it. She’s on to us, guys! Busted again!

  166. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 5:23 am

    lol!!! @ Razor X great sarcastic quips.. I think you truly can’t stand her stuff.. and it’s probably legit in your eyes.. can’t fault you for that… everyone has an opinion.. maybe yours is a bit more razor sharp… ouch! it doesn’t hurt me one bit… I got a good laugh!!!!

  167. Phil
    September 6, 2009 at 6:14 am

    Yeah, I think sassy with vibe was TOTALLY in 25 years ago in pop music. I guess that means Country Music is about 25 years behind the times.
    As far as the song being relevant goes, I think that is irrelevant. Although I doubt most guys are scanning the room leaning up against a record machine. Unless I’m missing out on something here. I guess it could be in an old town in Southeast Oklahoma somewhere since the definition of a Cowboy Casanova in the Urban Dictionary is “a fake ass cowboy hailing from SE Oklahoma who thinks he has charm, romance, and wit to score with attractive females. But doesn’t!” Relevancy does not make a song good.

    Nobody has even hardly touched on the actual lyrics of the song yet. Then again, there is a good reason for that. Basically, what I get from the lyrics is she is comparing the “cowboy casanova” to both the forbidden fruit in the Garden Of Eden and the snake (the devil). It is tempting and looks delicious, but it is the only thing she is not allowed to have. Carrie is playing the role of God in the song, and telling her she must not have the apple (cowboy casanova) and fall for its charm because the guy is really a snake and the devil in disguise and will entice her to take a bite which will lead to misery. And we all know the story of Adam and Eve, and what happened, and how Eve was deceived by the snake to eat the apple, and how good it tasted at first, but what misery it led to.
    That’s about as much of an analysis as this song will get from me.

  168. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 6:15 am

    again I think this song is relevant b/c most girls fall for this casanova type b/c he knows how to play women, say the right things whilst she is in his 2×4 range.. but the minute she steps out of it, and another girl steps in.. whamo, he’s forgotten her name.. heck, maybe whilst she is still in his range.. he may even take a bathroom breather to chase down the other conquest.. all the while this girl is completely captivated by his overwhelming charm, only to find out he’s a total cad.. a real loser..! Carrie is just posting a gale warning…!!! like a hurricane is coming.. BEWARE!!!!

  169. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 6:22 am

    PHIL is it? I think you don’t listen to much music if you think vibe was in 25 years ago… ?? hello??? I’m not dissing you but vibe is rhythm. It’s what makes your toe tap when you hear a song.. It’s what captures your ear with most uptempo songs.. It may be ear candy for sure.. but it works on most levels.. and look at the charts… most, if not all the hit songs have vibe in them.. even the country songs… maybe not the melodic ballads.. but the rest, yes… I’m a huge listener to music.. a huge music fan.. and I think this is just fact..

  170. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 6:27 am

    and yes Phil, your comparison to the garden of eden is quite correct.. it is like taken a bite of the poison apple… it will lead to illness.. a bad case of food poisoning.. who the heck wants that.. You’re not a girl, you’ll never get it.. and if you think players don’t exist, you’re in total denial.. or you’re a player who wants to keep the status quo, shush Carrie don’t give away our deep dark secrets already.. .. LOL!!!!

  171. Phil
    September 6, 2009 at 6:50 am

    Ummm…I was 13 years old 25 years ago and the pop music back then was much like the Pop/Country music of today. Maybe I don’t understand your definition of sassy with vibe. How about Madonna’s “Material World” or “Girls Just wanna have fun” by Cindy Lauper as a couple of examples? Or maybe even “Call Me” by Blondie before that.

    Anyway Karen and all you ladies out there. Your best bet is to stay away from places that “cowboy casanovas” hangout in the first place. You only have yourselves to blame for going out at night (when they come out according to the song) to the bars when and where they hang out and setting yourselves up for falling for his charms in the first place. That’s my advice. But that probably wouldn’t make a much better song than the one Carrie just released.

  172. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 7:09 am

    Honey, they’re not just out at night.. they’re everywhere among in the workplace, schools etc… can’t escape em! I can name some I work with now. Rather not.. Anyway, I’m not a bar hopper, was in my twenties.. EARLY twenties.. so u sure have a point there… but yes, the vibe is a bit different today but it still exists, and it’s present on most songs that make your toe tap… You’re probably not a listener of much of it… so you don’t know.. You like what you like and that’s fine.. everyone has their own taste..

  173. Vicki
    September 6, 2009 at 8:08 am

    Hey is it time to close off the comment area on this article. I think what’s been said has been covered and rehashed over and over.

  174. Um, so not country
    September 6, 2009 at 10:38 am

    Hoping country radio accepts this song for what it is, which is not country, except for the title..a big thumbs down to this one.

  175. merlefan49
    September 6, 2009 at 11:02 am

    Not impressed at all.

  176. Stormy
    September 6, 2009 at 11:25 am

    A couple of things haven’t been covered:

    1. The vibes have been arouns since the 20s. This song does not feature any vibes. Vibes are a percussion instrument which sounds like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0nOo1k7LoY. See, not in this song at all.

    2. If a guy keeps looking over your shoulder for the next best thing, that just means you aren’t the best thing. Mary J and I don’t have that problem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co941gzKj2Q.
    BWT: That’s sass with attitude. Whining about some guy not liking you is not sassy nor possessant of attitude. Its just whining.

  177. Dan
    September 6, 2009 at 1:44 pm

    She’s already finished the music video for this song and it shouldn’t take much longer before it gets released. Sales are going to be huge for this single and the album. Just like her other two CDs, this one is going to be another geat Christmas present. If Carrie keeps releasing songs such as this one, she is going to be around for a long time!

  178. TexasVet
    September 6, 2009 at 5:47 pm

    A+ review from All About Music: http://allaboutmusiccompany.yolasite.com/reviews.php

    Snippet: Carrie is the “Queen” of Country Music today. Martina McBride was big for a while but no one has been as big as Carrie female wise in Country music this decade. Carrie hit a home run in this single and it just keeps fans on their seat waiting for Play On on November 3rd. What agreat single to start with from Carrie.

    Grade: A+

  179. J.R. Journey
    September 6, 2009 at 6:16 pm

    Stormy’s #2 point is an excellent one too.

  180. Billy
    September 6, 2009 at 6:39 pm

    This isn’t terrible, but it’s not great. I give it a C+ to a B.

  181. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 7:48 pm

    @stormy.. that’s not sassy, that’s delusional self confidence.. these women think their men don’t need anyone but them, all the while they’re cheating on them but they’re the last to find out b/c they’re such ego maniacs… lol

    what I mean by vibe is toe tapping rhythm.. that’s all.. you’re getting way too technical there.. I mean if you want to get into it, doesn’t the bass.. or any percussion instrument create vibes of some kind..

  182. Stormy
    September 6, 2009 at 8:00 pm

    Karen: What exactly is “sassy” or “empowering” about whinning about boys?
    This goes way back to me feeling sorry for girls who are coming of age now and did not have the benefits of coming of age in the 90′s where we had Hole and Mary Chapin Carpenter and Lauren Hill and Suzy Boggus. Where, in short, we were encouraged to be goddesses rather than pricesses.
    Oh and by the way, I know Sassy, I grew up on Sassy. This song would have been mercilessly mocked by Sassy.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sassy_(magazine)

    Toe tapping rythms have been in country music since Jimmie Rodgers wanted a new mama.

  183. Stormy
    September 6, 2009 at 8:01 pm

    Wasn’t my orginal tagent on that subject also inspired by a Carrie song?

  184. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 8:14 pm

    I was a bit older when that mag came out I think.. probably in my twenties.. I was more into cosmo, but it seems like a cool thing.. I do vaguely remember it. Are you a sassy writer?

    As far as whining goes.. I don’t think it’s whining… she seems pretty finished with the dude.. just as I’m finished with this thread.. fun tho.

  185. Stormy
    September 6, 2009 at 8:16 pm

    Ahhhh, Cosmo. No wonder you think this song is empowering.

  186. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 8:23 pm

    Are you a musician? hmmm… from the UK? a feminist?

    must be… you remind me of someone I know.. lol

    I don’t read cosmo anymore.. used to about 20 years ago. Yeah, I tend to like the shallow stuff.. takes me away from my misery, which is loaded with death and sickness.. I really need a calgon bath but I don’t have a big enough tub, so I read tabloids instead.. and apparently listen to artistically bankrupt artists… I actually like all kinds of artists.. but I just love an angry-girl song.. gets my blood pumping.. lol

  187. karen
    September 6, 2009 at 8:26 pm

    To prove your point about sassy you’ve got to give me some more example than the one you did.. I’m taking some notes here.. lol

    U’r obviously a sassy songwriter..

  188. Jerry
    September 6, 2009 at 8:59 pm

    Where can we read the official statement from Sony? The supposed email posted on a blog only said they didn’t want the pop version leaked.

    http://leslietstexas.blogspot.com/2009/09/new-carrie-underwood-single.html

    They just didn’t want country radio hearing that version and people thinking it’s for country. Nothing was said to deny the future release of either version to pop radio and it’s way too early to know if they will or won’t release it. Carrie might have the final say and Taylor’s success and the decrease in album sales adds more pressure to do it. I didn’t mean Carrie would be contradicting herself and she’s free to do what she wants.

    I’ve heard rough demos before and the pop version doesn’t sound like a rough or inferior mix. It sounds like a final cut ready for pop radio. They took the same vocal track for the country version and added a lot more synthesized music to it. Demo singers sing demos and when Carrie recorded Some Hearts her producer called her “one take Carrie” so she doesn’t need to do multiple takes. Her voice is clearer on the country version because it wasn’t streamed on radio. The pop version The Wolf played sounds high quality turned lower quality over the stream. There’s nothing else inferior about the leaked version unless you just don’t like it.

    Why would Carrie let anyone make a different pop version, and since her label knows her feelings about multiple versions why would they make another one unless they want it on pop radio? The pop version is obviously way too pop for country radio to play so the label knew it wasn’t going to country. It sounds like they just don’t want people to know a legit pop version exists until that time comes if it does.

    http://www.idollive.net/2009/09/carrie-underwoods-cowboy-casanova.html

    Carrie Underwood’s “Cowboy Casanova” single cover revealed

    Apparently the unveiling of Carrie Underwood’s latest single, “Cowboy Casanova,” came a little earlier than expected thanks to the song leaking last night. Carrie blogged on her official fan club today saying that the song was scheduled to be released next week, but the leak forced her label to get it out there in order to squash any unwanted ramifications.

    Speaking of ramifications, last night’s “world premiere” of “Cowboy Casanova” on 100.7 The Wolf, a country radio station in Seattle, Wash., was in fact an unofficial version of the song. It featured a more pop feel complete with synths and absent of any true country style, which confused fans for a short period of time before it was confirmed that the version was not the correct one. It was interesting, however, that there was no denying that the more pop-ified version was perhaps a version tweaked for a Top 40 release a la Taylor Swift, so that option still hangs in the balance. Talk about a headache for camp Carrie.

    A new item of note regarding the single today comes in the form of its cover art, which will accompany the song’s release at digital music retailers next Tuesday. Carrie definitely looks more dolled up here than she does on her album cover for Play On, but it fits the song’s edginess and rock feel.

  189. Vicki
    September 6, 2009 at 10:38 pm

    Looks like Swift is playing hardball. Just in time for Carrie’s album, she is re-releasing “Fearless” with 6 new tracts.

  190. Jon
    September 6, 2009 at 10:59 pm

    Jim, your complaint certainly has a lot of projection. “Constant personal attacks?” Nope, not unless you take simple disagreement as such. You’re far more focused on personality than I; for instance, I have rarely, if ever, brought up the fact that I’ve had a career as a music journalist, whereas you frequently allude to it. And this “old gatekeeper” stuff depends on ignoring – or being unaware of – the fact that I’ve largely disengaged from that career over the past 5 years. You seem to think of me as a competitor, but I’m not; the role of The Critic is all yours, and it’s one I never aspired to in the first place.

    I don’t give a rip about gatekeepers, bloggers or any of that; I like country music, I’m interested in reading about it and discussing it, and I like to do that here. And when someone says something that strikes me as questionable or wrong, I might say so – whether it’s another commenter (like Stormy or Stewman or Kelly or Razor X, whom I quoted in the post that got you going to begin with), or one of the writers here, like Karlie or Juli or you. It is not, in fact, all about you.

    If there’s anything that’s properly characterized as “the problem” here, it’s your tendency to defend whatever you’ve said at the moment, because when you give in to it, it’s easy to undercut yourself. In this thread, for instance, you argue that no one would call even artists more popular among country radio listeners “the future of country music,” apparently forgetting that you yourself wrote “Jamey Johnson is the future of country music” not two months ago. Similary, even though you got the answer, “my grandfather,” directly from John Rich when you asked him who “the man” in “The Good Lord And The Man” was, just weeks later you went on for several posts dismissing the possibility that it might be…his grandfather.

    Enthusiasm and passion can be fine things, but they’re less likely to be so without a long perspective and at least a bit of humility. And that’s not a personal attack, it’s just a bit of advice.

  191. kevin w
    September 6, 2009 at 11:33 pm

    “And when someone says something that strikes me as questionable or wrong, I might say so”

    And keep doing it. I may not agree with everything you type, but I do appreciate your posts on here. You bring a different view and you make good points most of the time.

  192. Steve from Boston
    September 7, 2009 at 12:26 am

    “Snippet: Carrie is the “Queen” of Country Music today. Martina McBride was big for a while but no one has been as big as Carrie female wise in Country music this decade. Carrie hit a home run in this single and it just keeps fans on their seat waiting for Play On on November 3rd. What agreat single to start with from Carrie.

    Grade: A+”

    To call Carrie Underwood “The Queen of Country Music” really devalues the phrase, as she for the most part makes artistically insignificant music.

    She is a uspurper, the true Queens of Country are in exile, relegated to the fringes of airplay to make room for offerings like Carrie’s latest vapid effort.

  193. Hilary Chow
    September 7, 2009 at 4:17 am

    This is a very negative review, in fact, 9513 always gives negative reviews to Carrie…C’mon, don’t expect any artists to release a ground-breaking tone that will be remembered for decades.

    And no matter you think Carrie’s music is country or not, it’s a fact that she’s very popular in country music scene, so in anyway she qualifies the title “Queen of Country Music”.

    Btw, for those who think Cowboy Casanova is similar with Xtina’s Candyman, have you really checked out the lyric of both songs? Carrie’s warning everyone to stay away from the cowboy, while Xtina is quite neutral, or even favorable to the candyman.

  194. Hilary Chow
    September 7, 2009 at 4:20 am

    ^ Oops, just find out something.
    Someone said it’s possible to have a pop mix of the track, this is totally absurd since Carrie has blogged a few days ago saying she has never recorded two versions, and that unfinished, unpolished version, which was indeed a demo, and was never meant to be heard.

  195. Mando
    September 7, 2009 at 5:01 am

    Then I would like to know what the reason is in even having a popmix. The leaking of a rough unpolished ‘country’ demo makes sense but a pop one? That mix does not sound unpolished or unfinished. It would be ready to send of to popstations if the label would want that. I believe CU that she may not want to resort to releasing remixversions but the label has the final say.

  196. JD
    September 7, 2009 at 11:08 am

    @JON: “Enthusiasm and passion can be fine things, but they’re less likely to be so without a long perspective and at least a bit of humility”

    I really enjoy the ongoing sparring between Jon and Jim but I gotta say it… Jon, you wouldn’t know humility if it jumped up and bit you on your ass.

  197. Steve from Boston
    September 7, 2009 at 11:42 am

    “And no matter you think Carrie’s music is country or not, it’s a fact that she’s very popular in country music scene, so in anyway she qualifies the title “Queen of Country Music”.”

    So you basicically confirm my point, that Country music today is mostly a popularity contest, and has very little to do with quality music or artistic merit.

    It is no longer a necessity to be artistically proficient or significant, or to have any level of artistic maturity to be designated “Queen of Country” today, it is only necessary to be “popular” and sell tons of records…Heck one doesn’t even need to sound country anymore to qualify. Very sad.

  198. Paul W Dennis
    September 7, 2009 at 11:51 am

    Jim – in order to keep the Carrie trolls off your back I suggest you not review any more Carrie Underwood songs. It can’t be worth the aggravation dealing with that unthinking mob

  199. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 12:02 pm

    Children, Kitty Wells is still the Queen of Country. And not a one of you is experienced enough to overrule Fred Rose on the matter.

  200. Gavin
    September 7, 2009 at 12:22 pm

    Actually, Steve from Boston, people consider her the “Queen of Country Music” because she is the 3 time reigning Female Vocalist of Country Music and the current ACM Entertainer of the Year. Her artistic merits are subject to opinion, her achievements are not. For the people who question Carrie as a person fake or otherwise here is an article you might not enjoy reading.

    http://www.fox23.com/news/local/story/Carrie-Underwood-Donates-To-Schools/O4nDcW0SN064cLGb4r9D9A.cspx

    Press release from Academy of Country Music

    “We are so lucky as a school district and a town to have an ambassador like Carrie,” said Brian Terry, Principal of Checotah High School. “She was Valedictorian here and continues to be an outstanding citizen of Checotah. Today was a very special day for the students and faculty.”

    “When Carrie came to us with this idea, it just seemed a natural fit,” said Erin Spahn, who met with Underwood earlier this summer to plan the gift. “The Board of ACM Lifting Lives liked the concept so well, we’ve decided to build on it. Every year, we will present a matching gift opportunity to the ACM Entertainer of the Year for any endeavor that uplifts through the power of music. Carrie started that ball rolling, and we’re really proud to be a part of this with her today.”

    “I am so proud to have come from such a wonderful community that helped shape me as a person,” said Underwood, “and I can think of nothing better than to share the gift of music with the students in my hometown. It’s so great to be able to give back in a way that can truly better the lives of these kids and help create dreams and opportunities. I’d like to give a very special thanks to the Academy of Country Music’s ‘Lifting Lives’ for helping me make this dream come true.”

    Now doesn’t this seem like something the “Queen of Country Music” would do?

  201. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 12:41 pm

    Actually, I think Carrie’s new song pretty much sums up what I think of today’s music (and society in general) in a nutshell. Think about the “Cowboy Casanova” as being the Music Industry (or pretty much any industry in our society today). It’s all about image and personality over creativity and substance. So in that sense, just replace “Cowboy Casanova” and think of it is as being our society and its values today. I think Reality TV (American Idol, Survivor, America’s Got Talent, etc.) is a big reason for it, as they are anything but real. Kind of like the Celebrity obsessed, media run society we live in today. Take it from me, it’s like a disease. It looks like a cool drink of water but it’s nothing but candy coated misery. And yes, most reality TV shows are only come on at night. Just a coincindence I suppose. It’s just too bad so many people have been deceived by it, and actually buy it…let alone watch it and listen to it.
    But the music of the time has always been a good barometer of our society’s values and beliefs…so what does today’s music tell you about our society today?

  202. Jon
    September 7, 2009 at 1:04 pm

    Though I don’t think it’s too likely to happen, if enough people start calling Carrie Underwood the “Queen of Country Music,” then that’s what she’ll be, Stormy. P.S. Fred Rose did as much to put the pop influence into country music in his time as anyone you complain about today. P.P.S. Plus which, he’s been dead for nearly 55 years, and is unlikely to pronounce any more on the subject of who the”Queen of Country Music” is.

  203. TexasVet
    September 7, 2009 at 1:12 pm

    “A+ review from All About Music”

    Disregard this link and review I posted. Apparently this is a bogus site run by a kid.
    Anyone that would grade George Strait’s last two albums as D- & C- has to be a moron.

  204. Steve from Boston
    September 7, 2009 at 1:14 pm

    “Actually, Steve from Boston, people consider her the “Queen of Country Music” because she is the 3 time reigning Female Vocalist of Country Music and the current ACM Entertainer of the Year. Her artistic merits are subject to opinion, her achievements are not. For the people who question Carrie as a person fake or otherwise here is an article you might not enjoy reading.”

    Gavin, those are bestowed accomplishments, and not creative acomplishments. She has only achieved what, two albums and one upcoming so far? The awards bestowed on Carrie may or may not be deserved, but her output of music quantity, if not quality, has not been significant. Yeah, her impact on the market and the awards is overwhelming, but this is all based on very little output, and I would argue VERY little artistic maturity or merit.

    The conferring of the title Female Vocalist of the Year, etc, can be theoretically undeserved, and is not intrinsically an indication of merit. Kinda like some recipients of honorary degrees are not always deserving. In both cases, political and monetary considerations may be factors, as well as a bandwagon effect. Remember, Carrie achieved incredible momentum from that reality show and a built in fan base, which I think gave her an unfair advantage.

    But NONE of this is necessarily a reflection of her worth as a person…I for one, am not taking any shots at her as a person, in fact, who wouldnt want to ride this wave of commercial sucess? And she does have an incredible voice, and in time she may well realize it’s artistic potential. I just feel that she is already being unjustly celebrated as though she has already achieved great pinnacles of artistry.

    Her acclaim is actually outrunning her artistry by leaps and bounds…

    That, and the kind of vapid pop-country she and her people are peddling, have a destructively distorting effect on market, awards orginazitations and even on the venerated institutions of Country music.

    In short, citing the quantity of awards achieved in this case is just an extention of the popularity and sales factor, and has very little to do with artistic merit.

  205. I feel sorry for all of you!
    September 7, 2009 at 1:44 pm

    From Steve:
    “But the music of the time has always been a good barometer of our society’s values and beliefs…so what does today’s music tell you about our society today?”

    It tells me there will always be creative people out there that will make changes and shake up the worlds of those who are stuck in the past. Causing angry feelings and disbelief.. like most of the posters on this thread.. You guys need to lighten up a bit…

  206. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 2:02 pm

    I can’t believe anybody even takes those award shows seriously. Especially the ACM’s and CMA’s…I watched them both, and saw right through exactly how the Industry is just using these awards as tools to create artists and for promotional and publicity purposes only to sell more records. Carrie (and Taylor) are a marketing creation drummed up by the Industry (and they used these award shows to help create it). Then again, so are most of the artists today. So I just snicker when people bring up all the awards that Carrie (and Taylor) have won.
    Oh…but I did find it funny when Carrie won CMA artist of the year in 2006, and Faith Hill was like “What!”. Whether she was serious or not, I guess it doesn’t matter.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1bwMOc0I7Y

  207. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 2:12 pm

    Jon: I don’t complain about pop influences in country. I complain about songs like this that are Bangle’s esque pop being called country.

  208. Erik
    September 7, 2009 at 2:31 pm

    I would be like “WHAT?!?!??!?!” too (though perhaps more mentally) if I were watching an inferior artist take home the award I deserved.

  209. Gavin
    September 7, 2009 at 2:59 pm

    So i guess Tammy and Loretta should just pitch all their awards because they mean nothing or is it just Carrie and Taylor’s that mean nothing. Total BS. Steve, why don’t you give me your theory on why the other A. I. champs other than Kelly are no where to be found? What happened to that unfair advantage they had over everyone? Fact is Carrie had the talent and work ethic to take advantage of it so please don’t group her with a bunch of reality stars that have done nothing. You say Carrie had an unfair advantage and to me it sounds like Carrie made a very smart decision. Whether you say she has or hasn’t brought artistry to the genre is purely opinion and nothing more.

  210. SteveM.
    September 7, 2009 at 3:00 pm

    If Carrie Underwood is the queen of country, I think it is time for a coup.

  211. Jerry
    September 7, 2009 at 3:02 pm

    A pop mix isn’t just possible, it already exists. It leaked, The Wolf played it and many people heard it. Carrie didn’t need to record two versions because the label, producer, or someone involved used the same vocal track to make at least two versions. That doesn’t mean Carrie herself recorded two versions and she’s correct in saying she didn’t. You do realize that each piece of a song is recorded on many separate tracks so that changes and mixes can be made later without redoing the entire process? Singers and musicians don’t have to record their parts of a song at the same time or place. It’s easy to make a pop mix of a vocal track since they just add synthesizer. I understand why fans are denying it exists after all of the bragging they have done about Carrie not making pop mixes and bashing Taylor for doing it. Technically, Taylor doesn’t remix either.

  212. Kayla
    September 7, 2009 at 3:20 pm

    Well… Obviously this song has mixed reviews.. but.. If my opinion matters to anyone (not that it does) I think this song is catchy and not what Carrie usually does. I like her music though. I’ve been a fan since American Idol.. But it just seems like she always tells a story with her songs… Which is good but it get’s kinda boring. I like personal songs.. Taylor Swift does a good job.. Her voice just isn’t the greatest.. But anyway, I give this song a thumbs up.. I like it..

  213. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 3:35 pm

    No…I’m not saying that Tammy and Loretta should pitch their awards. The Music Industry is at a much different place then it was at that time. Yes, things have changed. Anyway, for those saying that we are living in the past, you could not be anymore offbase. The fact of the matter is I look to the past to see how we got to where we are today. Maybe the music industry would be wise to do the same. Otherwise, based off the decisions it is making right now, its future will continue to look bleak. I mean is it just a coincidence that the Music Industry went from a $15 billion industry to a $10 billion industry in 10 years when all the consolidation of the labels was taking place? And the music industry sits there and blames the Ipod and Piracy for its problems when the fact of the matter is they have always resisted technology and didn’t take advantage of missed opportunities when they presented themselves. Heck, we’d still be listening to 78 RPM records if they had there way. So maybe its the music industry that is stuck in the past.

  214. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 3:56 pm

    Oh yeah…and I still blame Reality TV and shows like American Idol as well for exploiting and helping to turn the Music of today, and the artists being promototed into nothing more than a personality and popularity contest based more on image than talent. Good music has always been more about the artist that creates it, not the actual person who that artist is. And the latter is the biggest problem I have with today’s mainstream music.

  215. Jon
    September 7, 2009 at 4:02 pm

    “Jon: I don’t complain about pop influences in country. I complain about songs like this that are Bangle’s esque pop being called country.”

    There’s a distinction without a difference.

  216. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 4:16 pm

    There is a distinction with a difference you either cannot hear or pretend not to. Believe it or not, the rest of us are not musically illiterate idiots. We know that Patsy Cline was country-pop. But the problem is that we are NOT musically illiterate idiots. Many of us remember when music that sounds like this was played daily on the top 40 pop charts. And, actually, when this very artist was played on the top 40 pop charts. About six months ago.

  217. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 4:40 pm

    It’s just another Manic Monday (oh woe)
    Wish it was Sunday (oh woe)
    ‘Cause that’s my funday (oh woe)

  218. Peter
    September 7, 2009 at 4:54 pm

    @Phil: …written by Prince who also wrote “Nothing Compares To U”, which, to my ears, would make an outstanding country song

  219. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 5:03 pm

    Yes…Thank you Peter. I knew that. I probably should have given credit. And thanks Stormy for getting that song stuck in my head. I do love Susanna Hoffs singing voice. Maybe I am living in the past…
    Just out of curiosity, which female Country Artist of today do you think would do the best cover of “Nothing Compares To U”?

  220. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 5:07 pm

    Leeann Womack.

  221. Jon
    September 7, 2009 at 5:08 pm

    In the first place, Stormy, why don’t you drop the royal plural? Do you think your opinions are more valid when you pretend there’s a mass of like-minded robots behind you? And in the second place, what the hell kind of pop music do you think Patsy Cline’s music was influenced by? Stuff from the Roaring 20s? Here, let me save you the trouble: it was the kind of pop music that was being played on pop radio right at the same time. So if Underwood’s being influenced by contemporary pop artists, well, she’s following right in Cline & Company’s footsteps. And if she’s getting on the pop charts, well, so what? Do you think she’s the first country artist to do so?

  222. kevin w
    September 7, 2009 at 5:21 pm

    “And in the second place, what the hell kind of pop music do you think Patsy Cline’s music was influenced by? Stuff from the Roaring 20s? Here, let me save you the trouble: it was the kind of pop music that was being played on pop radio right at the same time.”

    Very true, and that is worth pointing out.

  223. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 5:29 pm

    Haha…well, in my opinion most of today’s Country Pop sounds more like it was influenced by 80′s Pop to me. Country Music seems to be about 25 years behind the times. I’ll have to listen to her Pop version of this song. If it is still out there.

  224. Dan
    September 7, 2009 at 5:52 pm

    Every famous celebrity has their fair share of haters – that’s a given. But, Carrie Underwood won’t be affected by this at all. She will still win multiple awards, sell millions of records, sing at sold out events, and do wonders throughout her lifetime. It’s been over 4 years, and she’s not slowing down. Her third CD will only add to her success. Long after her release dates, her songs will still be heard and talked about. All of the winners (and some non-winners) from American Idol had a strong fan base. Carrie is just one of the few who have actually lived up to what their fans were expecting. She didn’t disappoint and has gained a lot more fans who didn’t watch the show thanks to some of her greatest songs such as “Jesus, Take the Wheel”, “Before He Cheats”, and “All-American Girl”. I’m sure “Cowboy Casanova” will also be considered one of her greatest hits and more people will climb aboard on the Carrie wagon.

  225. sess
    September 7, 2009 at 6:46 pm

    Who new one gal could create so much debate over a single release, there are so many different topics going on in this thread. They say people will be negative to make themselves feel better about themselve, when feeling inferior or jealous. It looks as usual at the 9513 there is a lot of that going as always when it comes to a Carrie discussion.

    I wasn’t sure about the single I had to listen to it for a good half hour to take in all aspects of it and I think it was a great choice for a lead single. She is reinventing herself with this woman anthem and if it does crossover it could be bigger then BHC because of the upbeat tempo.

  226. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 7:02 pm

    Jon: There are two problems with your theory:

    Problem one: “Influenced by” Carrie’s music is not “influenced,” it is a replica.

    Problem two: The Bangles aren’t contemporary and haven’t been played since long before Belinda Carlise went into rehab, a decade before she was on Dancing With the Stars.

    AS I said before, the rest of us on this board aren’t raving morons. I can certainly hear Glen Miller and Patti Page in Patsy’s music. I cannot hear Brittany Speares or Rhiana in Carrie’s. Yes she got Dre’s producer to help her out, but remember Eminem’s fist song–the one about how everyone’s forgotten about Dre? The one from almost a decade ago?

  227. Jon
    September 7, 2009 at 7:56 pm

    No, Stormy, I don’t remember Eminem’s song, nor Britney Spears’, nor Rhianna’s; I’m first and foremost a country music fan, so that’s mostly what I listen to, along with a little jazz, blues, and a few other things. I’m just not interested in pop music per se, and I don’t really care much about which pop artists did or didn’t influence a particular country artist. As I’ve said elsewhere, you and the other pop fans should feel free to argue for and against your favorite pop artists for as long and as loudly as you like; it’s simply immaterial to me, since I know that country artists have always been influenced by those from other genres, and what counts for me is whether I like their music, not whether I like their influences’ music. But Carrie Underwood’s obviously a country artist, so “influence,” whether right-now-this-minute contemporary or contemporary as of a few years ago, is indeed the right word.

  228. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 8:19 pm

    I fail to see where it is “obvious” that Carrie is a country singer, particularly as she seems fairly adverse to singing any country..

  229. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 8:27 pm

    PS: 1984 was not a few years ago. The Bangles have not been popular in Carrie’s lifespan.

  230. Razor X
    September 7, 2009 at 8:34 pm

    PS: 1984 was not a few years ago.

    It was if you are very old.

  231. Razor X
    September 7, 2009 at 8:51 pm

    And in the second place, what the hell kind of pop music do you think Patsy Cline’s music was influenced by? Stuff from the Roaring 20s? Here, let me save you the trouble: it was the kind of pop music that was being played on pop radio right at the same time.

    Actually, she recorded a lot of pop songs that were already standards by the time she got to them.

  232. TexasVet
    September 7, 2009 at 8:53 pm

    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    Will the last person to post in this thread please turn off the lights when you’re done.

  233. kevin w
    September 7, 2009 at 8:55 pm

    “I fail to see where it is “obvious” that Carrie is a country singer, particularly as she seems fairly adverse to singing any country..”

    Um, “I Told You So”? With Randy Travis? Don’t let the facts get in the way of your dislike of Carrie.
    (I’m not a Carrie Underwood fan by any means, but that comment was just absurd)

  234. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 9:01 pm

    The problem I have is people who defend Carrie’s music, are really just defending Carrie the person, and not Carrie the artist. She could release any song, and they would say it is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I was not alive in the 60′s, but I talked to my mother about how things were different back then. She said it was more of a cultural phenomenon where people stood up for causes and the music reflected that at the time. You could tell if somebody was a fan of the Beatles or The Beach Boys just by the clothes they wore.
    Anyway, to get back on topic. I have nothing personal against Carrie Underwood and who she is as a person, as I do not pretend to know her personally. What I have is personal against Carrie Underwood and who she is as an Artist. To me, she is just an Industry creation to get a wider audience to listen to Country Music, and build the male Artists fanbases, while at the same time alienating a huge portion of people who actually know what Country Music is, and making it impossible for other female artists to have a chance at success. The same thing was going on in the 70′s with the likes of Olivia Newton-John and John Denver…but at least they were able to do so more as the artist they defined themselves as, rather than the person and artist the Industry has defined Carrie as. And tell me this: Why are there so many guys who like her music when none of her songs are geared toward the male audience, and half of them actually bash guys? It’s because many of them like her for who she is as a Person over who she is as an Artist thanks to American Idol and our Celebrity obsessed culture and 24/7 Entertainment News Media. Yes, Carrie is a talented artist with a nice voice…but she (or the industry) is using her personality to sell records. But the mainstream music industry is basically marketing all of its product to females and the AI Celebrity obsessed audience exclusively, and leaving out everybody else because they are the easiest to target, and who buy most of the music today. Not that more guys wouldn’t, but why would they if it’s not being marketed to them? That is the problem I have. Country radio has gone from having a listening audience that was practically split down the middle 10 years ago between the two genders…last I heard it was 57 % to 43 % female listenership and growing.
    There was an article about why Darious Rucker was able to make it in Country Music and why Jessica Simpson was not. The article came to the conclusion that the Country Music Audience picks its winners and losers. I completely disagree with that conclusion. The reason is because Country Music has always been a fraternity of male artists with very few female artists being able to be successful at any one given time. Country radio still plays at least 5 times more male artists for every 1 female artist. And if you look at the charts, the only 2 female artists consistently in the Top 10 are Carrie and Taylor. Right now, there is not one solo female artist in the Top 20 (although I am looking forward to the competition between Carrie and Taylor’s new singles to see which one goes to number 1 first). That is what the Industry has created, and probably how it wants it. It’s just a popularity contest between Carrie and Taylor, and every other female artist is just seen as competition to their fans. Any time an article mentions Carrie or Taylor, a fan war breaks out between Carrie and Taylor fans about who is better. So of course Jessica Simpson didn’t make it, and Darius Rucker did…
    And lastly, I want to say that I read the article called the New Face Of Country in the New York Times, where it basically says the Industry is looking for more Artists to sign based off of Taylor Swift’s success. Don’t they understand that because of the Business model they employ there is only room for one Taylor and one Carrie at a time (I think they do)? They should be looking for female artists who can differentiate themselves from Carrie and Taylor…not base who they sign off of somebody else’s success. Even Mallary Hope’s new song is just another version of Carrie’s “Just A Dream”, and Jesse Lee’s song “It’s A Girl Thing” sounds like anything Taylor Swift would release. They haven’t been getting too much radio play as far as I know. And look at what happened to Kristy Lee Cook when Arista basically marketed her by making her out to be another Carrie Underwood, and never let her define herself as an artist. They tried the personality over the artist approach. Good Lord, even in her video she does her hair the same way and wears some of the same clothes that Carrie wore in “Before He Cheats”. How is she supposed to compete with that when all the money is going to Carrie and Taylor? Trickle Down Economics does not work in the Music Industry. The rich stay rich (Carrie and Taylor), and the rest stay poor. Basically, today it seems the Industry is too busy trying to find copycat artists they can easily create, rather than let artists just create themselves. Hence, everything and everyone starts sounding (and even looking) the same. Those are only my opinions.

  235. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 9:25 pm

    Phil: Doesn’t the fact that she had to throw Randy Travis in the mix to make the song country speak for itself?

  236. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 9:31 pm

    Yeah, well I thought the soul purpose of releasing that song in the first place was to go after the traditional Country audience. I don’t think it worked, and unfortunately I don’t think Carrie delivers or connects with her songs emotionally like the artists of the past who could to pull it off…at least not by herself.

  237. Jon
    September 7, 2009 at 9:39 pm

    Stormy: “PS: 1984 was not a few years ago. The Bangles have not been popular in Carrie’s lifespan.”

    Well, as Razor points out (sort of), that’s kind of relative (and BTW, technically speaking, you’re wrong; Underwood was born in 1983, and the Bangles’ peak seems, according to allmusic, to have been a few years after that). Country music’s been around for about 100 years; 25 years isn’t a whole lot in that context. And neither the Carter Family nor Hank Williams was popular in The Darlin’s lifetimes, yet that doesn’t seem to bother you – so again, it seems clear that your objection isn’t to pop influences per se, but rather to the particular ones. And again, I say that as a country music fan, as opposed to the kind of pop fan you seem to be, I see no reason why I should care about that in evaluating whether Underwood’s a country artist.

    Razor: “Actually, she [Patsy Cline] recorded a lot of pop songs that were already standards by the time she got to them.”

    Really? Name 20. Or heck, name 10. That seems like a generously low floor for “lots.”

  238. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 9:44 pm

    The scale we are using is Carrie’s life.

  239. Jerry
    September 7, 2009 at 9:44 pm

    People who care about country music and want Carrie and radio to remain country without selling out to pop and poorly written, cheesy songs are haters? Isn’t that a bit extreme? Cowboy Casanova is barely country, unoriginal and below most of today’s country songs. It’s not in the same league as Jesus, Take the Wheel, Before He Cheats, or All-American Girl because they were better penned.

    If country radio sells out to another bad pop song I’m sure this will be one of her greatest hits. If radio doesn’t sell out it shouldn’t pass #30 and that’s being generous. If other artists released the same song it wouldn’t pass #40 because they don’t have the same preferential treatment. A small number of artists can release any bad song and it will go to #1. That’s why radio has gone downhill. Who wants to be barraged by bad and so-so songs? Bring on the ipods, bye-bye radio.

    Like a domino effect, releasing Cowboy Casanova and playing it to death will lower the already lower standards, causing more artists to release bad and so-so songs and radio to play them. Where’s the quality control? Is Carrie trying to compete with Taylor by co-writing every song on her album instead of picking better songs? Fans said she doesn’t need to write because she’s the top vocalist. What happened to that idea?

  240. Stormy
    September 7, 2009 at 9:49 pm

    And again, we are’t talking about and influence except in the since that The Red Hot Chilli Pepper’s Dani California was “inspired” by Last Dance with Mary Jane.

  241. SteveM.
    September 7, 2009 at 10:13 pm

    When was Belinda Carlisle on Dancing with the Stars? I despise reality TV almost as much as Carrie Underwood, but for her I would make a exception.

  242. karen
    September 7, 2009 at 10:20 pm

    interesting.. do you think if there were more “artists” or self defined artists as you describe, the men would stand up, take notice and run out and buy the cd’s by these women?.. curious.. if u look at utube stats on the videos you see the bulk of the watchers of Carrie’s videos are women and girls.. so that’s mostly her audience and she does fine. Now, we know that Brad Paisley’s has a mostly female audience too i’d bet.. In fact I’d bet most of the music is bought by women. I really like this not so mainstream artist who has millions of views on utube both sexes.. millions. When her first cd came out it only sold about 170,000… I’d venture to guess that all those millions of views were men watching her, over and over.. She’s pretty. but she also has 200,000 plus subscribers. It didn’t translate.. It didn’t help that her single wasn’t a huge hit I’m sure.. I just don’t think men buy music like women, except maybe traditional country and maybe rock fans. I think that’s why the the country charts are dominated by men. Men buy men’s music usually, then factor in that women also buy men’s music, even more than men do.. So, female artists are in a tough spot, don’t blame it on Carrie Underwood.

  243. Dan
    September 7, 2009 at 10:54 pm

    Well, “Cowboy Casanova” is making its debut at number 35 on the country charts!!

    Jerry, you better get out your ipod because she’s nearing 30 rather quickly.

    Music always evolves. Traditional country is evolving into Contemporary country. The transition has already taken place. So, you can either get on board or you can say, “No Thanks” and stop listening. The likes of Carrie, Taylor,Rascal Flatts, Sugarland, Kellie, Brad, Keith, etc. are here to stay until the next stage of evolving takes place. Traditional is becoming a thing of the past, but some people obviously are not ready for the change.

  244. Razor X
    September 7, 2009 at 10:59 pm

    Razor: “Actually, she [Patsy Cline] recorded a lot of pop songs that were already standards by the time she got to them.”

    Really? Name 20. Or heck, name 10. That seems like a generously low floor for “lots.”

    1. Heartaches
    2. You Made Me Love You (I Didn’t Want To Do It)
    3. Bill Bailey, Won’t You Please Come Home
    4. You Were Only Fooling (While I Was Falling In Love)
    5. Anytime
    6. True Love
    7. The Wayward Wind
    8. Have You Ever Been Lonely(Have You Ever Been Blue)
    9. You Belong To Me
    10. Seven Lonely Days

    “Lots” is another relative term, and one has to bear in mind that Cline had a very short recording career.

  245. Phil
    September 7, 2009 at 11:19 pm

    I’m not blaming it on Carrie Underwood…I’m blaming it on the Business Model that Country Music uses.
    As far as would more guys stand up and buy music from female Country artists goes…well, it would definitely help if they would quit releasing all of these songs that put guys in a bad light, and/or only relateable to the female audience. I mean, seriously, the songs they are releasing to radio are all geared toward one specific audience. Yes, mainstream Country Radio’s target audience is females between the ages of 25 and 54, (and now they want to ensure their kids are part of that audience as well), but that doesn’t mean they have to exclude males…especially with the female artists, and the songs they are releasing to radio by them.
    As far as giving examples of songs that put guys in a bad light goes. Let me name a few. “Before He Cheats” and Cowboy Casanova” by Carrie Underwood; “Red High Heels” and “Best Days Of Your Life” by Kellie Pickler; “Gunpowder and Lead” and “Dead Flowers” by Miranda Lambert; “Picture To Burn” and “Should’ve Said No” by Taylor Swift; “When I said I would” by Whitney Duncan; “15 Minutes Of Shame” by Kristy Lee Cook. But the biggest problem I have is most of these songs are all about who the artist singing them is as a person rather than who the person singing them is as an artist. So I’m waiting for the female Country Artists to define themselves as artists…rather than as the person they are in many of their songs which seems to be the problem with most of today’s mainstream music in general. It’s all about who the person is, rather than who the artist is that defines them.
    Anyway…guys are buying a lot of music today I’m sure…for their kids. That’s probably how the music industry sees as the easiest way to get money out of them.

  246. Steve from Boston
    September 7, 2009 at 11:23 pm

    “If Carrie Underwood is the queen of country, I think it is time for a coup.”

    YES! Because the true Queens of Country are mostly in exile, and they should be restored to their rightful place on the throne, and recieve the airplay and awards they so richly deserve.

    It is a scandal that their quality work is pushed aside to make room for crap like cowboy casanova…

    “Queen of Country” HA!, more like Princess…but even then “Princess of Pop” would be more accurate, but I guess Carrie’s competing with Taylor for that designation.

  247. Steve from Boston
    September 7, 2009 at 11:41 pm

    And Gavin, some folks like Tammy and Loretta deserved their awards..And to paraphrase Lloyd Bentsen, Carrie Underwood is no Tammy Wynette or Loretta Lynn! (Loretta herself, as well as Connie Smith has been quoted recently as saying that what passes for country music nowadays is mostly pop, or words to that effect.)

    I’ll say it again, Carrie’s acclaim has outrun her artistry by leaps and bounds, and it is throwing everything off kilter. I stand by that.

    But I’ll grant you that Carrie has taken advantage of her unfair advantage, and what distinquishes her from her AI peers is a great voice. And she has worked hard to capitalize on the boost she recieved, no doubt. Now if only she would give real Country more than token nods, and not waste her gift on garbage, and develop some artistic maturity, she may one day grow into her acclaim, and grow worthy of her laughably (and revoltingly) premature title of “Queen of Country”

  248. Vance
    September 7, 2009 at 11:43 pm

    Since Country is dying, why talk about it? Let’s just let it die silently since it doesn’t have a future.

  249. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 12:48 am

    10. Seven Lonely Days

    um, I believe this was originaly a country song done by Bonnie Lou on the King label in 1953, which was later done by pop singer Georgia Gibbs. And later done by Jean Sheppard.

  250. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 12:50 am

    5. Anytime

    Again, I think this was country too, although I could be wrong

  251. James
    September 8, 2009 at 4:55 am

    Love the song!!! I will definitely buy her album. This is not even a fair review, just like his other reviews about Carrie’s singles — all are negative.

    Thumbs UP!
    great music even if it’s country or not!

  252. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 6:02 am

    10. Seven Lonely Days

    um, I believe this was originaly a country song done by Bonnie Lou on the King label in 1953, which was later done by pop singer Georgia Gibbs. And later done by Jean Sheppard.

    Fine. Replace that with “Lonely Street”, then.

    5. Anytime

    Again, I think this was country too, although I could be wrong

    It’s a pop song dating back to the 1920s.

  253. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 6:44 am

    Dan: We do say “no thanks” and stop listening. And then country record labels bitch because no one is buying their music.

  254. sess
    September 8, 2009 at 7:09 am

    Music changes as time changes as people change, if there wasn’t any change life would be very montonous.

    With the progression of Country Music Carrie is now today’s Tammy and Patsy and that is fact, and one that some tradtionalist will never face. They are stubbornd and can’t let music evolve. Crap you don’t see 250 comments about Brad singing about the future or Dierks singing about getting sideways (totally pop). Why? Cause they are male and they are allowed to progress apparently.

    So why is it so bad for people support Carrie if they like her traditionalist support their music by bashing others it makes them feel better because their artists don’t get any attention because the majority doesn’t know or care who they are. It doesn’t make you more of a cou ntry music fan if you like these no names then the people who like the Carrie’s and Brad’s of the genre.

    Moral is get off you traditional high horse repetitive band wagon, let a song be a song, let people like what they want and you go on liking what you want.

    I could care less where this or Taylors song goes on the charts but this constint debate of which tradtionalist can sound more intelligent and use the bigger word and use more examples, is exhausting to read when you are just trying to read about the actual topic of do you like the song or not.

    Get over yourself people.

  255. stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 7:55 am

    Sounding like 80′s pop is hardly evolution.

    Also, PS: Most people on this board would laugh at the idea that I am a tradionalist.

  256. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 8:08 am

    “‘ 10. Seven Lonely Days

    um, I believe this was originaly a country song done by Bonnie Lou on the King label in 1953, which was later done by pop singer Georgia Gibbs. And later done by Jean Sheppard.

    Fine. Replace that with “Lonely Street”, then.’”

    Now that’s funny! “Lonely Street” was written in the late 50s by Carl Belew; it had been a hit by Andy Williams a little more than a year before Cline recorded it.

    There are a couple of songs on your list that I’ll grant you, but most of them serve to illustrate my point more than yours. “True Love” was written in 1956; “The Wayward Wind” was a pop hit that same year; “Have You Ever Been Lonely” had been a country hit for Ernest Tubb in 1949, and Jaye P. Morgan had had a pop hit with it in 1955; “You Belong To Me” was a country song (written by Pee Wee King and Redd Stewart), first recorded as a country record in 1952; and “Anytime” was not only a big pop hit in 1952, but a huge country hit for Eddy Arnold in 1944. You might as well have included “Lovesick Blues,” also “a pop song written in the 20s.”

    So most of what you call “pop songs that had already become standards” by the time she recorded them were actually either country standards and/or fairly recent pop hits. And more importantly, they were done in contemporary pop stylings, which is really the point.

  257. Paul W Dennis
    September 8, 2009 at 8:19 am

    “Any Time” dates back to the 1920s , was recorded by both Eddie Fisher and Eddy Arnold years later, Eddy’s version (1947) a few years before Eddie’s version (early 1950s)

  258. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 8:39 am

    “Any Time” dates back to the 1920s , was recorded by both Eddie Fisher and Eddy Arnold years later, Eddy’s version (1947) a few years before Eddie’s version (early 1950s)

    I see. I just knew the Eddy Arnold version. Patsy may have just known that version too.

  259. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 9:04 am

    So most of what you call “pop songs that had already become standards” by the time she recorded them were actually either country standards and/or fairly recent pop hits. And more importantly, they were done in contemporary pop stylings, which is really the point.

    No, the point was that they were all older songs (by a few years at least) by the time Cline got to them. They weren’t songs currently on the pop charts in 1961-63.

  260. martha
    September 8, 2009 at 9:48 am

    seriously, you are delusional. I love this song, and i feel like this is the most true to carrie song she has ever put out. Thank god for her that over aged males with horrible opinions of todays music are not her demographic.

  261. Jim Malec
    September 8, 2009 at 9:49 am

    @Martha:

    I’m too young, I’m too old–I just can’t win!

  262. Jack
    September 8, 2009 at 9:54 am

    I do have to comment on this thread again. It is obvious just how important Carrie is to country music when one song of hers can cause such heated debate about the nature of the genre itself. I just cannot get over how a little single can stir up such a hornet’s nest of debate. Love her or hate her, I cannot think of any other country artist who can stir up such strong opinions. As long as the discussion is respectful, such debate is very healthy, and again you have to give Carrie some credit for it.

    For a young woman, who is just trying to put out music that will appeal to her fans, she has managed to up-end much of the Nashville establishment. Why? Probably because country music was fading into the sunset before Carrie came along and she shook things up. Of course, now country has Taylor Swift who is dominating the genre way more than Carrie ever did. Will country survive the “Age of Carrie and Taylor”? Who knows, but the genre will never be the same after them.

  263. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 9:54 am

    Holy cow, Razor, so if Taylor Swift’s next single is a cover of “Jesus Take The Wheel,” you’re going to be telling us that she’s released an older song that’s become a standard?! Give me a break. Most of the songs you listed had been recent (as in, “a few years”) hits, and she was doing them in what was largely a contemporary pop style. The whole point was to appeal to a pop-leaning or pop-friendly audience that mostly would have remembered hearing those songs just a couple of years ago.

  264. Stormy Lewis
    September 8, 2009 at 10:05 am

    Jack
    September 8, 2009 at 9:54 am Permalink I do have to comment on this thread again. It is obvious just how important Carrie is to country music when one song of hers can cause such heated debate about the nature of the genre itself. I just cannot get over how a little single can stir up such a hornet’s nest of debate. Love her or hate her, I cannot think of any other country artist who can stir up such strong opinions. As long as the discussion is respectful, such debate is very healthy, and again you have to give Carrie some credit for it.

    You have obviously never heard She Left Me For Jesus.

  265. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 11:01 am

    “Jesus Take The Wheel” will never be a standard.

  266. Phil
    September 8, 2009 at 11:02 am

    Jack, I do respect your opinion. But I see things differently. To me, Carrie Underwood (and Taylor Swift) are simply marketing triumphs created by the industry to bring in a wider audience of Country Music listeners. And both have played their roles very well. But if it weren’t Carrie (and Taylor) it would have been somebody else…and we’d be talking about them right now instead of Carrie (and Taylor). Whether or not those new fans they have brought in are loyal to Country music, or just Taylor and Carrie is yet to be seen.
    I think that it will take a female “artist” who can break the barrier and reach both the Pop and the Traditional Country audience, while at the same time actually pave the way for more female country artists to become successful will be the true measuring stick of somebody who shakes up Country music. And to me, Carrie and Taylor have done neither. In fact, they’re making it that much harder for other female Counry artists to have a chance at success. They are just part of the Nashville machine. And I’m not blaming either one…but I’m not giving them any more credit than what they were designed and created for by the industry in the first place.

  267. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 11:02 am

    Thank god for her that over aged males with horrible opinions of todays music are not her demographic.

    On behalf of over-aged males everywhere, we are also thankful not to be part of Carrie’s demographic.

  268. Tom
    September 8, 2009 at 11:05 am

    taylornation could!

  269. Stormy Lewis
    September 8, 2009 at 11:18 am

    Taylor does not have an actual nation. If she did we could invoke the Genevia Convention to make her stop singing.

  270. Steve from Boston
    September 8, 2009 at 12:19 pm

    “On behalf of over-aged males everywhere, we are also thankful not to be part of Carrie’s demographic.”

    Amen to that! And this is the problem when twelve year olds are given the right to vote with their dollars, we end up with folks like Carrie being called “Queen of Country” which I will never accept.

  271. merlefan49
    September 8, 2009 at 12:51 pm

    The queen of country music just turned 90.

  272. merlefan49
    September 8, 2009 at 12:56 pm

    Gavin,-
    Neko Case-Kasey Chambers-OCMS-Dale Watson wouldn’t want to be doing what Carrie is either which is jumping through the hoops the labels hold, keeping their lips pressed to the suit’s rumps and jumping how high the labels tell them etc.

  273. merlefan49
    September 8, 2009 at 12:59 pm

    Neko Case-Kasey Chambers-OCMS-Dale Watson
    Got where they are by hard work and not winning a glorified karaoke contest.

  274. Dan
    September 8, 2009 at 1:14 pm

    As of today, “Cowboy Casanova” moves up to #31.

    Her songs are amazing and this song will surely be Carrie’s 11th number 1!

    There is at least 6 American Idol CDs coming this October and November. It will be interesting to see which ones come out on top and which ones will fade away. But, we all know that Carrie is going to lead the pack.

  275. Steve from Boston
    September 8, 2009 at 1:15 pm

    “The queen of country music just turned 90.”

    Kitty Wells? I can accept that, but there are other true Queens as well, some still active today, like Loretta, Dolly, Patty, Reba and Trisha.

  276. merlefan49
    September 8, 2009 at 2:08 pm

    If it hadn’t been for Kitty opening the doors back when country was a male dominated genre who knows what would have happened.

  277. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 2:30 pm

    “If it hadn’t been for Kitty opening the doors back when country was a male dominated genre who knows what would have happened.”

    Not to take anything away from Kitty Wells’ many accomplishments, but if she hadn’t, it seems inevitable that someone else would have opened those same doors. So yeah, no one knows what would have happened, but there’s plenty of room for educated guesses ;-).

  278. Stormy Lewis
    September 8, 2009 at 2:33 pm

    Last I checked the genre was still pretty male dominated.

  279. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 2:45 pm

    “Jesus Take The Wheel” will never be a standard.”

    LOL we’ll see in 30 years. You never know.

  280. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 2:51 pm

    “On behalf of over-aged males everywhere, we are also thankful not to be part of Carrie’s demographic.”

    Then why talk about Carrie in the first place?

  281. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 2:53 pm

    “Not to take anything away from Kitty Wells’ many accomplishments, but if she hadn’t, it seems inevitable that someone else would have opened those same doors. So yeah, no one knows what would have happened, but there’s plenty of room for educated guesses ;-”

    Point is, SOMEBODY had to do it, and she did it. Good for her, and I hope she lives to have many more birtdays.

  282. Gavin
    September 8, 2009 at 3:51 pm

    merlefan49, a glorified karaoke contest where they get raked thru the coals in front of 30 million people every week. You make it sound like it was an easy thing to perform every week on that show. I’d like to see how Neko Case, Kasey Chambers, OCMS, and Dale Watson would fair under the same circumstances. My guess is not very well.

    Phil, you blame or don’t blame Carrie and Taylor for what again? Why don’t the other females pull their boot straps up and get them selves noticed because Carrie and Taylor ain’t going to stop for none of them. Carrie hasn’t had new music for 5 months and it seems nothing has changed. Thats 5 months for a new or current female artist to take the bull by the horns. Lets point that finger elsewhere.

    As far as Taylor or Carrie jumping thru hoops of any kind is just plain delusional thinking. Hell, Taylor might as well be President and CEO. Can an artist who jumps thru hoops and is played like a puppet do what Carrie Underwood did here:

    “When Carrie came to us with this idea, it just seemed a natural fit,” said Erin Spahn, who met with Underwood earlier this summer to plan the gift. “The Board of ACM Lifting Lives liked the concept so well, we’ve decided to build on it. Every year, we will present a matching gift opportunity to the ACM Entertainer of the Year for any endeavor that uplifts through the power of music. Carrie started that ball rolling, and we’re really proud to be a part of this with her today.”

    Did Kenny Chesney or anyone before him think to do something like this? I honestly don’t know.

  283. merlefan49
    September 8, 2009 at 4:05 pm

    You really don’t think Carrie or Taylor is in charge of their own careers do you ?

  284. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 4:08 pm

    I’d like to see how Neko Case, Kasey Chambers, OCMS, and Dale Watson would fair under the same circumstances. My guess is not very well.

    Why do you say that?

  285. merlefan49
    September 8, 2009 at 4:11 pm

    Better yet how would Carrie fair at “Ginny’s Little Longhorn”

  286. Stormy Lewis
    September 8, 2009 at 4:23 pm

    You make it sound like it was an easy thing to perform every week on that show. I’d like to see how Neko Case, Kasey Chambers, OCMS, and Dale Watson would fair under the same circumstances. My guess is not very well.

    These are people who already rotuinely perform 20-30 songs a night several nights a week. Usually while playing an intrument.

  287. Stormy Lewis
    September 8, 2009 at 4:24 pm

    “When Carrie came to us with this idea, it just seemed a natural fit,” said Erin Spahn, who met with Underwood earlier this summer to plan the gift. “The Board of ACM Lifting Lives liked the concept so well, we’ve decided to build on it. Every year, we will present a matching gift opportunity to the ACM Entertainer of the Year for any endeavor that uplifts through the power of music. Carrie started that ball rolling, and we’re really proud to be a part of this with her today.”

    Probably just about anyone could present just about any company with a publicity opportunity.

  288. Gavin
    September 8, 2009 at 5:30 pm

    I’m talking about singing for judges that criticize everything from their voice to what they wear in front of a live audience and 30 million people across the nation. Completely different than performing in front of your fans don’t ya think?

    You really don’t think Carrie or Taylor is in charge of their own careers do you ?

    After 11 million albums sold 10 #1′s out of the box and an EOY award and 1.2 million sold on her Carnival Ride Tour hell yes I do. You don’t think they asked Carrie to record different versions as to cross over to pop and make more money? You betcha they have. She said no. They don’t run her like you think they do. Taylor owns Big Machine Records.

  289. Gavin
    September 8, 2009 at 5:35 pm

    “Underwood is a young woman with a once-in-a-lifetime voice who could literally take any artistic path; that she chooses the most trodden path of all is an example of one of music’s most tragic wastes of talent.”

    Over exaggerate much? Wow.

  290. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 6:11 pm

    Carrie got to make her bones in front of a ready made friendly audience who would cheer the fact that there was air in the room. Neko made her bones singing in front of drunk guys who would occassionally take a break to yell out requests for Freebird. She had to win them over wthout the benefit of applause signs, a wardrobe department or a snarky judge for the fans to root against. How would Carrie have survived that environment? There are vast disadvantages to doing things the hard way–namely you have to sing dreck like this instead of densely layered nature metaphors and songs about victims of the Green River Killer–but there are always disavantages to doing things the easy way. Carrie did not want to do the work, she does not get to reap the rewards.

  291. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 6:46 pm

    Neko Case? Isn’t she the one who put 18 minutes of crickets chirping on her latest record? Yeah, boy, that’s sure doing it the hard way, isn’t it – and it doesn’t get more country than that, does it?

    But seriously. Underwood’s like most country singers, singing in church and local venues while she was in high school. She had a history before American Idol came along. Like them or not, that’s true of most country artists, and I’d bet of most performers in general. And I guess it’s time to point out again that Connie Smith got her deal as the result of a talent contest, never playing in bars. Tammy Wynette, just about the same – she wasn’t doing a lot of local gigs before she got her deal. Anyone here remember Stonewall Jackson’s story?

    Really, this “hard way” stuff is a bunch of hooey. And yes, some of Underwood’s fans here are over the top with their claims, but the same with some of Underwood’s detractors. The opposite of black-and-white stupidity is not white-and-black stupidity.

  292. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 7:07 pm

    “Really, this “hard way” stuff is a bunch of hooey. And yes, some of Underwood’s fans here are over the top with their claims, but the same with some of Underwood’s detractors. The opposite of black-and-white stupidity is not white-and-black stupidity.”

    I’m not one to eagerly jump on Jon’s bandwagon, but after reading half of these comments (I can’t stomach any more), I couldn’t agree with him more, right down to how Carrie got her start being irrelevant, especially considering how other very respected artists have gotten their seemingly easy starts. In fact, I was going to specifically mention Connie Smith as an example before noticing Jon’s mention of her. Even George Strait didn’t walk a long winding road to his success.

  293. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 7:39 pm

    Neko Case? Isn’t she the one who put 18 minutes of crickets chirping on her latest record? Yeah, boy, that’s sure doing it the hard way, isn’t it – and it doesn’t get more country than that, does it?

    No, she put thirty minutes of crickets chirping AND frogs croacking on the end of her cd. She also repurposed parts from an old player paino and the arm of an old analog machine to make other instruments on her album. When Carrie gets creative enough that she can use her equipment to make other equipment, she too can put as many crickets on her album as she wants.

  294. Brady Vercher
    September 8, 2009 at 7:42 pm

    My dog barks louder than all y’alls dogs put together!!!

  295. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 7:43 pm

    Leeann: The problem is that Carrie has actually said that she had to work HARDER because she was on AI.

    And, like I said, it does her no favors. Now that she is in the thick of it and has to tour 300 days a year for crowds that aren’t always there just to hear her, not she starts complaining about the work and the “haters” and the like. One has to look no further than Susan Boyle to see the value of coming up through the ranks rather than coming up through a magic door.

  296. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 7:46 pm

    Brady: My cat can kick your dogs ass!

  297. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 7:49 pm

    “No, she put thirty minutes of crickets chirping AND frogs croacking on the end of her cd. She also repurposed parts from an old player paino and the arm of an old analog machine to make other instruments on her album. When Carrie gets creative enough that she can use her equipment to make other equipment, she too can put as many crickets on her album as she wants.”

    Oh, well, 30 minutes, crickets AND frogs; that is, indeed, a lot harder. Of course, by that measure, there are mighty few who haven’t taken the easy way of, you know, singing, songwriting, stuff like that.

    Now, I’m not ragging on Neko – I liked The Virginian pretty well, even if subsequent albums have taken her further and further into musical areas in which I have little interest, plus which, she’s been an enjoyable conversationalist on several occasions – and those Underwood fans who seem to think that she (or Dale Watson or whomever) would melt into little pools of anxiety on a show like American Idol are being silly. But so is anyone who holds her up as some kind of holy anti-Carrie Underwood. The fact is, at the end of the day, the two have at least as much in common with one another as they do with their respective fans (at least the over the top ones), and probably quite a bit more.

  298. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 7:54 pm

    But she exactly the anti-Carrie Underwood.

  299. Brady Vercher
    September 8, 2009 at 7:54 pm

    Brady: My cat can kick your dogs ass!

    Yeah, but your cat can’t bark!

    Oh, and I heard Neko Case was a cheerleader…if that counts for anything.

  300. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 7:58 pm

    Are you sure? Neko did not spend much time in High School and spent even less time attending high school.
    She was in this awesome video for Maow:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk3GYN6M4-U

  301. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 8:00 pm

    Melissa Etheridge was a cheerleader if that makes you feel better. Of course, so was George Bush……..

  302. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 8:08 pm

    Over exaggerate much? Wow.

    This coming from the same person who said:

    Taylor owns Big Machine Records.

    ????

  303. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 8:08 pm

    Stormy,

    I really can’t speak to the comments to which you’re referring, as I know nothing about them. I still don’t think, even if she said them, that they have any real bearing on whether or not she’s paid her dues in relation to other artists. And this is coming from someone who is, admittedly, not a Carrie Underwood enthusiast. For me, she’s not my taste, but she’s got lots of talent. So, while I’m certainly not adverse to saying whether or not I like a given song of hers,I’ve just grown very weary of the same “she hasn’t paid her dues” arguments against her. Unlike Rascal Flatts (a group I’m admittedly extremely harsh about), I feel she cares about country music, its history and can hold her own in a live setting.

    As for Neko Case, language saying that she’s the anti Carrie is just silly, since they do completely different things. For that matter, Alison Krauss is also the anti-Neko Case, which is fine.

    By the way, aside from Neko’s reverb obsession, the whole cricket thing isn’t my type of art. I’m amused that people defend it as such.

  304. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 8:14 pm

    The thing is that Neko and Carrie line up exactly on opposite sides of the metaphor–like Dale Watson and Tim McGraw, Bono and Charles Manson; Kayne West and Jack White.

  305. Tara Seetharam
    September 8, 2009 at 8:15 pm

    “Now that she is in the thick of it and has to tour 300 days a year for crowds that aren’t always there just to hear her, not she starts complaining about the work and the “haters” and the like.”

    Can you substantiate please?

  306. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 8:19 pm

    The interview she gave where she said that American Idol meant she has to work harderand the one where she complained about haters saying that she is not country.

  307. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 8:24 pm

    So, while I’m certainly not adverse to saying whether or not I like a given song of hers,I’ve just grown very weary of the same “she hasn’t paid her dues” arguments against her …

    It’s not so much a matter of paying (or not paying) one’s dues. It’s a matter of Carrie’s music not living up to all the hype. It’s not entirely her fault; perhaps nobody can live up to that kind of hype. I wasn’t much bothered by her when she first arrived on the scene. Her music was never my cup of tea, but I think its quality has declined steadily with each album, and this latest single is particularly bad. After all the success she’s had, she surely has access to the best material that Nashville has to offer. And to top it all off, she co-wrote this latest song, so it’s not something that was forced upon her. We keep hearing about all of her potential, but what we’re actually hearing from her is not encouraging.

    I’d also like to add that that the over-the-top praise from the superfans hasn’t helped. In fact, it’s very off-putting had has the opposite effect of what they’re presumably trying to achieve. They might want to bear in mind that they are doing her a great disservice.

  308. Tara Seetharam
    September 8, 2009 at 8:32 pm

    “The interview she gave where she said that American Idol meant she has to work harderand the one where she complained about haters saying that she is not country.”

    I can’t pinpoint the interview in which she said AI meant she has to work harder, but I would imagine the logic is that she has to work harder to overcome the skeptics. Like you.

    And are you referring to this interview (http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20152857_2,00.html) about the “haters”? The one in which she is directly asked how she’ll prepare for the scrutiny she’ll receive with the second album, and what she thinks of the comments people have made of her on Amazon? If I were asked those questions, and had read a thread like this in which not only my music is judged, but my intentions, authenticity and character – I’d address the detractors, too. And I’d put money on it that you, and most on here, would, too.

    “I’d also like to add that that the over-the-top praise from the superfans hasn’t helped. In fact, it’s very off-putting had has the opposite effect of what they’re presumably trying to achieve. They might want to bear in mind that they are doing her a great disservice.”

    Right back atcha. The grandiose proclamations in these comments made by “real country music fans” don’t exactly make me want to be just like them.

  309. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 8:33 pm

    The over-the-top super fans certainly don’t help, but I really don’t think they’re being any worse than the over-the-top detracters either at this point. While I’m the first to be annoyed by over-the-top super fans, I also understand that there’s a boiling point and that not all Underwood fans are even over-the-top.

    If Carrie did say those things, I can’t blame her all that much. She’s under a tremendous amount of pressure and she really seems to be handling it quite well, in my opinion. I don’t fault anyone for a weak moment or two.

  310. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 8:34 pm

    For the record, I did not see Tara’s response before posting mine.:)

  311. Gavin
    September 8, 2009 at 8:35 pm

    To prove that she is more than a contest winner and AI is a different kind of dues paying. Also, people can say I’m not a country singer but I sing country music and haters will hate and there is nothing I can do about it. Stormy, is this the interview you are referring?

  312. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 8:45 pm

    If so, I think your rendering of it was a bit misconstrued.

  313. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 8:45 pm

    ,i>Right back atcha. The grandiose proclamations in these comments made by “real country music fans” don’t exactly make me want to be just like them.

    You don’t want to like country music??

  314. Gavin
    September 8, 2009 at 8:46 pm

    I know that I’m over the top and for a reason. Some of the negative comments are as over the top negative as mine are over the top positive not to mention that some seem dangerously close to personal attacks on her character.

  315. kevin w
    September 8, 2009 at 8:48 pm

    “It’s not so much a matter of paying (or not paying) one’s dues. It’s a matter of Carrie’s music not living up to all the hype”

    That’s your opinion, Razor. To other people it does.
    And you know what opinions are like…..

  316. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 8:54 pm

    That is one of them.

  317. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 8:58 pm

    C’mon, Razor, you know I like you, but that’s not what Tara was saying.

  318. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 8:58 pm

    It’s not so much a matter of paying (or not paying) one’s dues. It’s a matter of Carrie’s music not living up to all the hype”

    That’s your opinion, Razor. To other people it does.

    It’s kind of difficult, if not downright impossible, to exceed the expectations of the type of fans who go on the record to say that they could listen to Carrie (or any other artist) sing the phone book. “Cowboy Casanova” is a perfect example of what you get when you demand so little from your favorite entertainers.

  319. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 9:01 pm

    “The grandiose proclamations in these comments made by “real country music fans” don’t exactly make me want to be just like them.’

    You don’t want to like country music??”

    Now that’s funny!

    The fact that she put “real country music fans” in quotes suggests that she means something else.

  320. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 9:05 pm

    There’s no good reason to be over the top. In either direction.

  321. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 9:10 pm

    Absolutely.

  322. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 9:24 pm

    “It’s kind of difficult, if not downright impossible, to exceed the expectations of the type of fans who go on the record to say that they could listen to Carrie (or any other artist) sing the phone book.”

    That is literally nonsensical.

    And besides, not only does that “type of fan” – whose existence is most likely metaphorical rather than literal (have any of even her most over-the-top fans here said that?) – not constitute the universe of those who enjoy at least some of Carrie Underwood’s music, the expectations of such fans aren’t really “hype” in the first place; they’re more properly seen as perhaps being the result of hype.

    Reacting negatively to an artist’s music, or to the artist him- or herself, because of the maunderings of over-excited fans is a bad idea. For instance, I’d hate to see anyone get turned off to the idea of seeing what Neko Case or the Greencards or the Duhks have to offer simply because Stormy’s built up some heavy duty fantasies around them and tried to use them as sticks with which to beat the fans of artists she doesn’t like. Especially when there’s only two or three degrees of separation between any of them – Carrie, Neko, Greencards, etc.

  323. Leeann Ward
    September 8, 2009 at 9:36 pm

    For me, there’s some truth in what Razor is saying, but I agree that the “phonebook” line is likely metaphorical..or one of those lines that people just say. I’ve probably said that about Vince or Randy Travis before, but I’d obviously not literally stick around to hear them sing the phonebook. My issue with over-the-top super fans is when they can’t ever admit that their artist sings a bad song or calls fellow fans out for not liking a song of the artist by saying that they must not be “true fans.” I haven’t seen it happen on this thread, but certainly have read it on other threads (specifically an Underwood thread). While over-the-top fans may not necessarily make me like an artist’s music less, they do reduce the chance of making me look into an artist with which I’m not already familiar. Just like well written, well argued reviews easily prompt me to look into artists.

  324. Tara Seetharam
    September 8, 2009 at 9:44 pm

    “It’s kind of difficult, if not downright impossible, to exceed the expectations of the type of fans who go on the record to say that they could listen to Carrie (or any other artist) sing the phone book.”

    Quite similarly, I find it hard to believe that those who have called her “artistically bankrupt,” etc., will be able to recognize when Carrie does actually show artistic growth (or their kind of artistic growth).

    “…(have any of even her most over-the-top fans here said that?)”

    Yes they have – it’s somewhere above – and I’ll say it too. Those that hold it against me as a low expectation I’ve put on Carrie as an artist are clearly not “savvy” enough to recognize I’m using a figure of speech. Just like I’m not “savvy” enough to recognize that a commenter who puts me in the category of fanbots with dormant mental states is simply being “tongue-in-cheek”. I’m really not trying to be hostile; I’m just trying to point out why some Carrie fans, who actually might have something to contribute to this discussion, steer clear of this site.

    Stormy, it’d be great if you could find other interviews in which she’s complained about said subjects. I’ve rarely seen her complain about working hard – unless she’s talking collectively about her band.

  325. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 10:09 pm

    “It’s kind of difficult, if not downright impossible, to exceed the expectations of the type of fans who go on the record to say that they could listen to Carrie (or any other artist) sing the phone book.”

    That is literally nonsensical.

    No, it isn’t. How does an artist possibly NOT meet the expectations of fans who set the bar so low?

    (have any of even her most over-the-top fans here said that?)

    Yes, they have said it on many occasions, here and elsewhere.

    . ….And besides, not only does that “type of fan” – whose existence is most likely metaphorical rather than literal … — not constitute the universe of those who enjoy at least some of Carrie Underwood’s music …

    Nobody said that they constituted the universe of those who enjoy her music. I was talking about a specific segment of that group.

    the expectations of such fans aren’t really “hype” in the first place; they’re more properly seen as perhaps being the result of hype.

    Yes, the expectations of those fans and the hype are two different things. Nobody said otherwise. What’s your point?

  326. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 10:13 pm

    Yes they have – it’s somewhere above – and I’ll say it too. Those that hold it against me as a low expectation I’ve put on Carrie as an artist are clearly not “savvy” enough to recognize I’m using a figure of speech …

    People “get” that it’s a figure of speech, but what’s the meaning behind it? That you’ll love anything that she does. And that’s not exactly setting the bar very high.

  327. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 10:21 pm

    The point of paying ones dues is not that you earn anything by it; its that you learn something by it. Carrie started at the top, which means she is on a downhill slide. It will be a slow slide, but she has no experience on how to scramble and climb up that hill and she has no contacts to help her.

  328. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 10:33 pm

    “‘“It’s kind of difficult, if not downright impossible, to exceed the expectations of the type of fans who go on the record to say that they could listen to Carrie (or any other artist) sing the phone book.”

    That is literally nonsensical.’

    No, it isn’t. How does an artist possibly NOT meet the expectations of fans who set the bar so low?”

    Dude, think about it. You didn’t say “meet,” you said “exceed.” If they set the bar that low, then it’s difficult *not* to exceed their expectations.

    “‘ the expectations of such fans aren’t really “hype” in the first place; they’re more properly seen as perhaps being the result of hype.’

    Yes, the expectations of those fans and the hype are two different things. Nobody said otherwise. What’s your point?”

    You seemed to think otherwise when you linked the two. You wrote, ” It’s a matter of Carrie’s music not living up to all the hype,” and then when Kevin W pointed out that that’s your opinion, you brought up those fans by way of reply. If they’re irrelevant to the point Kevin W was responding to, why bring them into the picture in your reply?

    You appear to be a little confused.

  329. Jon
    September 8, 2009 at 10:35 pm

    “The point of paying ones dues is not that you earn anything by it; its that you learn something by it. Carrie started at the top, which means she is on a downhill slide.”

    Unless the top rises and she goes along with it. Though in point of fact, she didn’t start at the top, unless you consider singing in church and at local events as the top.

    But your concern for her psychological well-being is touching.

  330. Tara Seetharam
    September 8, 2009 at 10:43 pm

    “People “get” that it’s a figure of speech, but what’s the meaning behind it? That you’ll love anything that she does. And that’s not exactly setting the bar very high.”

    Actually, the context I’ve typically seen that figure of speech used in is when describing the vocal ability of an artist – not the preference one has for what an artist sings. I would agree that she’d sound good singing just about anything, but that doesn’t then mean I want her to sing just about anything.

  331. Stormy
    September 8, 2009 at 10:46 pm

    Jon: The top was 6 million albums which she reached 2 albums ago.

  332. Razor X
    September 8, 2009 at 10:59 pm

    You appear to be a little confused.

    You’re the one who’s confused.

    “‘“It’s kind of difficult, if not downright impossible, to exceed the expectations of the type of fans who go on the record to say that they could listen to Carrie (or any other artist) sing the phone book.”

    That is literally nonsensical.’

    OK, so I inadvertently left out the word NOT from my original statement, as I’m sure you knew. You do like to argue for the sake of it, don’t you?

    You seemed to think otherwise when you linked the two. You wrote, ” It’s a matter of Carrie’s music not living up to all the hype,” and then when Kevin W pointed out that that’s your opinion, you brought up those fans by way of reply. If they’re irrelevant to the point Kevin W was responding to, why bring them into the picture in your reply?

    I said her music doesn’t live up to the hype. Kevin said that some of her fans think it does. I replied that of course some of her fans do, because their standards are so low, it would be hard her NOT (emphasis on NOT, just to be perfectly clear)to live up to the hype in their eyes. In no way does that say that the hype and the expectations of those fans is the same thing.

    What part of this don’t you understand?

  333. Wade
    September 8, 2009 at 11:02 pm

    Well, i heard Cowboy Casanova on radio today, guess that means hell has frozen over solid…right? I just dont understand how anyone can even brainwash themselves into thinking this is remotely country music, even for todays standards… Taylor Swift looks like Loretta Lynn compared to Carries new song…(Not literally of course) but…

  334. Dan
    September 9, 2009 at 12:00 am

    Stormy: Carrie did not start out at the top as you have suggested. She was one of millions who auditioned for American Idol. She had to last week after week to gain fans on the show. She worked her way up and her hard work did not stop after winning the show. Her debut sold over 6.8 million records because she had amazing singles and songs. You claimed that she started right here on top because of the outstanding numbers she managed from her CD debut. If that’s the case, (which it’s not), how come Taylor Hicks’ debut didn’t reflect that of Carrie’s? Why wasn’t he placed at the top just like Carrie? Was it because of his gray hair? Carrie started out at the bottom just like every other American Idol contestant. She just happened to be extremely skilled, chose wonderful songs that many people could relate to, and was willing to go the distance – which is definitely a long way.

    Stormy: You said she is on her downhill slide and that she has no experience. At the beginning, she was new. So she has learned a lot since then and has since gained the experience she needed. She has no contacts to help her? Please, you’re right. Carrie hasn’t made a single friend since becoming a superstar. Stinks to be her, if she falls down any contact will just ignore and walk on by. First of all, her sliding down will be in extreme slow motion. If for some strange reason she does take a mighty fall, there will be plenty of contacts to guide her through and pull her right back. (But I honestly can’t forsee any Lindsay Lohan catastrophe in her near future.)

  335. kevin w
    September 9, 2009 at 12:35 am

    “The point of paying ones dues is not that you earn anything by it; its that you learn something by it. Carrie started at the top, which means she is on a downhill slide. It will be a slow slide, but she has no experience on how to scramble and climb up that hill and she has no contacts to help her.”

    Again, who knows? you don’t, and I don’t know what the future holds for her. Although, by reading your comments, you must pray for her downfall.

  336. kevin w
    September 9, 2009 at 12:43 am

    “Kevin said that some of her fans think it does. I replied that of course some of her fans do, because their standards are so low, it would be hard her NOT (emphasis on NOT, just to be perfectly clear)to live up to the hype in their eyes.”

    And again, this is your presumption of Carries fans.
    Unless you know a lot of her fans (and not those that are on the web) I don’t think you would know what their standards are of hers or anybodies music.

  337. Phil
    September 9, 2009 at 1:17 am

    Gavin: I simply said I’m not blaming Carrie (or Taylor) for other female artists not having a fair chance to be successful in Country Music. I’m blaming the Industry though for blatantly creating them for one purpose: To bring in a wider audience to Country Music. To me it’s obvious. I can’t see any way it was an accident. Which in turn, has just turned Country Music into one big personality and popularity contest between not only Carrie and Taylor fans, but all the female Country artists fans.
    It’s funny because I go on the Pulse Forum to see what Carrie fans are saying about her new single…and the only thing most of them care about is how many weeks it will take for it to get to number 1 on the charts, and what number it will debut. I just wonder if country radio decided to stop playing Carrie songs, and she decided to go the Pop Route, if her fans would still listen to Country Music. I would say no, they are loyal to Carrie, not Country. And the same can be said for Taylor. Then again, I think Country radio stations wouldn’t be dumb enough not to play her songs whether they are Country or not. Which is basically where we are headed it seems.
    Which leads us to your other question about why don’t other female artists pull their boot straps up? Why bother getting run over by the mob of Carrie and Taylor supporters who only see you as competition, or just don’t plain care unless your name happens to be Carrie or Taylor. The only way for an aspiring female Country singer to even have a remote chance to make it in Country Music today and get heard on the radio is to have a prebuilt in fanbase from either a Reality TV show (Julianne Hough, Whitney Duncan, Carrie, Miranda, and Kellie all on Reality shows), or in Taylor’s case…well, I won’t get into that.
    But you have to remember how much publicity and promotion Carrie and Taylor have been given in order to become the successes they have as well. And it’s sort of hard for any artist to compete with the kind of money being thrown at them. So yeah, pull on their boot staps and then what? Release a song that radio won’t play, go on a radio tour? Sing at bars and coffee shops? I mean seriously.

  338. Phil
    September 9, 2009 at 1:45 am

    Oops…Pulse Forum is the place to go to if you want to discuss and follow the Country charts…I guess I should have realized that. So disregard my comment about the Pulse Forum. My bad.

  339. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 2:03 am

    @ merlefan49…

    I do think Kitty Wells is a worthy Queen of Country, I just think the ladies that I listed are worthy heirs…far more so than the current designee by some on this thread. I kinda see it as a pyramid, something like this:

    Kitty Wells
    Loretta Lynn, Connie Smith
    Dolly Parton
    Patty Loveless, Reba, Trisha Yearwood..

    I think the stongest of the line after Kitty are Loretta, Dolly and Patty for advancing and perserving the rich heritage of pure Country music….But all of these talented ladies have been rightly called “Queen of Country” by various respected critics and journalists, and have truly earned the title.

    A valid chain of sucession, if not of direct influence.

    As for Carrie? “Princess of Nashville Pop” at best. (Sorry Carrie fans, but I think Shania and Martina are the Queens of that (sub)genre.)

  340. Jack
    September 9, 2009 at 5:04 am

    The sad thing here is that a lot of people seem to think they know what “country” music is. This reminds me of the Supreme Court justice who said he would know if something was pornography when he saw it. In other words, the definition of country music is you know it when you hear it. This is a empty definition, and is why those claiming Country Casanova is not a country song are just spouting a personal opinion as if it were fact. I even wonder if there is any formal musicological definition (codified and recognized by academic musicologists) of “country” so that songs can be actually measured in an objective way against it. Any academics here?

    The bottom line is that those people heaping huge amounts of trash talk on Carrie (and/or Taylor) personally or about their music in general, are just spouting their own personal opinions, not fact. I have no problem with someone saying they don’t like such and such, but to declare as fact something that is personal opinion is just irresponsible and a real act of hubris.

  341. Leeann Ward
    September 9, 2009 at 6:12 am

    I dunno, I love Trisha and Patty, but I just can’t agree that they’re considered queens of country music anywhere other than in some fans hearts. Reba at some point, yes. I’d say the same for Carrie too.

  342. Leeann Ward
    September 9, 2009 at 6:13 am

    For clarification, I mean that I wouldn’t label Carrie as a queen of country music either…though such terms are kind of pointless anyway.

  343. Stormy
    September 9, 2009 at 6:43 am

    Dan: I am not talking about friends. I am talking about club owners and promoters who would book her to help her out. Her contacts are all the people she will be owing money to.

    Kevin: If you have watched country music, you have seen it happen.

  344. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 7:49 am

    Leeann, Patty has been called the Queen of Country music by critics. It’s not just me, and it’s not just her fans.. I think these critics are refering to her authenticity and all she has done to advance and preserve the Traditional sound. The most recent example that I’ve found is from Country Standard Time when reviewing Sleepless Nights” refered to her as “Patty Loveless, aka the Queen of Country Music”. A.K.A….also KNOWN as… I doubt very much that publication was referring to her volume of sales, I kinda think they were citing her as the epitome of the authentic country sound, so in that sense, Patty certainly is a Queen of Country.

    As you know, she has also been called the Queen of Mountain Soul by Ralph Stanley himself…and it is not much of an extention to refer to her as the “Queen of Country Soul” as well.

    Trisha has also earned the title by her artistic integrity and she and Patty have on more than a few occasions been paired togther by critics as two of the absolute best in the business still active today.

    I could go on, but do you really want me to?! ;)

  345. Jon
    September 9, 2009 at 7:51 am

    “Dan: I am not talking about friends. I am talking about club owners and promoters who would book her to help her out. Her contacts are all the people she will be owing money to.”

    You have some funny ideas about how the music business works, Stormy.

  346. Stormy Lewis
    September 9, 2009 at 7:54 am

    Yeah, crazy me thinking that labels shelve albums that they fear will not make money and that club owners book acts who have filled their venues before.

  347. Stormy Lewis
    September 9, 2009 at 7:55 am

    Steve: Who else would be the Queen of Mountain Soul? It was Patty’s album, after all.

  348. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 8:32 am

    And Jack,I agree insomuch as there is some subjectivity when defining Country music. And of course it’s opinion, even when we state our opinions as assertions. But I ask you (and anyone else who claims that Carrie’s sound is real Country) to please explain to us what exactly is Country about Cowboy Cassanova (besides the title) or the bulk of Carrie’s work?

    Is it the twang in her vocals? (barely detectable)
    Is it her heavy use of fiddle and steel? (token at best) Somehow I hear more electric guitar and pop style drum beats…Is it her exquisite Country phasing and inflections? (I hear more power pop emoting than any sense of rustic nuance)

    I guess you don’t think those things are essential for a real Country sound, so why don’t you tell us, just what IS Country about this song and most of Carrie’s music?

    Being born in the South doesn’t automatically make one a Country singer, (Britney Spears) or even being signed by Nashville. It’s mostly Nashville Pop nowadays. Loretta Lynn has said as much, as has Connie Smith. They are with us “narrow minded” folks in lamenting the sad state of affairs and what passes for “country” nowadays.

    Sure it is opinion, and we are all entitled…but just saying something is Country doesn’t make it so. (and granted, saying it’s not doesn’t make it so either, but I think we have tried to give our reasons as to why we don’t think Carrie’s music is very country) And just because someone self-identifies as a country singer doesn’t make it so either, no matter how many awards they win or how many records they sell.

    I really have to laugh that so many of Carrie’s fans are vocal detractors of Taylor Swift. They take Taylor to task for being “too Pop, and not country at all.” To many of us the difference between them is only a matter of minute degree. Yeah, Carrie is a much better singer, and Taylor has a from-the-heart sound that rings with authenticity, but they are both very, very pop to many of us bystanders.

  349. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 8:37 am

    “Steve: Who else would be the Queen of Mountain Soul? It was Patty’s album, after all.”

    True, in that MS is an album title, but it is also another name for Mountain Music..and I think that is the sense in which Dr. Stanley was using it.

    Patty has called him the “KING of Mountain Soul” and he didn’t have an album by that name. So she was speaking in a similar fashion about him.

  350. kevin w
    September 9, 2009 at 8:52 am

    “Kevin: If you have watched country music, you have seen it happen.”

    Oh I know that’s true. What i’m saying (again) is that no one knows for a fact what will happen with her career.

  351. Stormy Lewis
    September 9, 2009 at 9:03 am

    No, but it is fairly easy to predict.

  352. Tara Seetharam
    September 9, 2009 at 9:06 am

    “Being born in the South doesn’t automatically make one a Country singer, (Britney Spears) or even being signed by Nashville. It’s mostly Nashville Pop nowadays. Loretta Lynn has said as much, as has Connie Smith. They are with us “narrow minded” folks in lamenting the sad state of affairs and what passes for “country” nowadays.”

    Steve – Loretta may share some of the sentiments on this thread, but certainly not all, and I think you’d be doing her a disservice by putting her in the same category as the majority of these posters. She had this to say about the current country music scene:

    “Well, I think it’s great. It’s changed a lot. Everything changes, nothing stays the same. … The music has probably gotten better. It’s more modern. Things keep getting modern. I like that. I think it’s more up-to-date than it used to be. I listen to the new stuff, because that’s all they play today is mostly the new stuff. If you want to hear anything else, you have to play it yourself.

    I like Carrie Underwood, for a female singer. She’s a great singer. And some of the guys I like … I like most of them. What’s that guy’s name that sings “Don’t Go Lovin’ On Nobody But Me”? There’s a bunch of guys I like.”

    https://secure.forumcomm.com/?publisher_ID=36&article_id=125369&CFID=105089044&CFTOKEN=78791500

  353. Mando
    September 9, 2009 at 9:15 am

    I listen to the new stuff, because that’s all they play today is mostly the new stuff. If you want to hear anything else, you have to play it yourself.

    I do sense a bit of criticism in that comment. She’s true tough radio only plays popcountry and doesnt give the wide range of subgenres any chance. So if you really want to learn about countrymusic you gotta go find it for yourself.

  354. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 9:18 am

    I think more recently than that Loretta stated in Country Weekly that there should be a stong dividing line between Country and Pop, and that line is getting far too blurred.

    And yes, Carrie is a fine singer, and no doubt a fine person. I just don’t think she is very Country…and what bothers me the most is how her type of music is being accepted as the new standard of country music, and how it completely dominates the charts, awards and the airwaves…leaving very little room for any traditional style artist to chart anymore.

    Carrie’s supporters say we are too narrow in our definition of Country. But Carrie’s brand of it, leaves very little room for anything else, especially the more traditonal sound. So much for the broad umbrella.

    So I hope you can understand anyway where we are coming from. Though our tastes differ, I always considered you a fair minded person.

    And again, we are not the only ones…Connie Smith’s criticicms of modern country are even stronger than some of Loretta’s..check out her interview on My Kind of Country.

  355. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 9:21 am

    Mando, it’s really sad that pop country has made the tradtional country sound a “subgenre”…I think it should be the other way around.

  356. Mando
    September 9, 2009 at 9:33 am

    IA Steve from Boston. Also besides the traditional country sound, I also think that accoustic and bluegrass music should be made more mainstream. The statement that it isnt commercially viable well then look at the succes of Oh Brother where art thou soundtrack or at success of Akus..

    Idd Kevin W what will happen with Carrie’s career is not certain but I think if Carrie does not start showing some artistic integrity & makes songs that are timeless and show who SHE is as an artist that she’ll be dropped & quickly forgotten when the next big vocalist comes along who “then” will be the hottest property in Nashville like Jim pointed out in his review. IMO Martina preceeded Carrie in that regard.

  357. Jack
    September 9, 2009 at 9:37 am

    Steve from Boston: Actually I’m from Boston too, and I basically agree with much of what you said in your reply to my last post. I don’t claim to know what “country” music is, the best definition I have is weak at best – namely a song is country if country radio plays it and the CMA and ACM associations recognize it as country. By that definition, Carrie and Taylor are both country singers. Also, expanding that definition, Taylor is also a “pop” singer since her songs are played all the time on pop radio stations and she is a fixture in Rolling Stone, Blender, and on MTV. (The only song of Carrie’s that has received any real spins outside of country so far is BHC. Carrie is essentially invisible to Rolling Stone and MTV, etc. I’m not sure one song qualifies her as a pop singer yet.)

    I like Country Casanova, I don’t think its trash, nor do I think it is high art. Taylor’s “Fifteen” is a better written song IMO. I’m guessing they both are country songs since country radio is playing them.

  358. kevin w
    September 9, 2009 at 9:42 am

    “Idd Kevin W what will happen with Carrie’s career is not certain but I think if Carrie does not start showing some artistic integrity & makes songs that are timeless and show who SHE is as an artist that she’ll be dropped & quickly forgotten when the next big vocalist comes along who “then” will be the hottest property in Nashville like Jim pointed out in his review. IMO Martina preceeded Carrie in that regard.”
    I would say artists like Deana Carter, Leann Womack, and, to a certain respect, Gretchen Wilson have more “artistic integrity” than Carrie Underwood. And look where their careers are.

  359. Jack
    September 9, 2009 at 9:50 am

    Let me amend my previous post slightly: I’m guessing that CC and Fifteen are “pop country” or “country pop” or “contemporary country” or “new country” songs because mainstream country stations are playing them. Neither song will ever be played on “traditional” or “classic” or honky tonk” or “bluegrass” etc. radio stations, I imagine.

  360. Tara Seetharam
    September 9, 2009 at 9:54 am

    “And yes, Carrie is a fine singer, and no doubt a fine person. I just don’t think she is very Country…and what bothers me the most is how her type of music is being accepted as the new standard of country music, and how it completely dominates the charts, awards and the airwaves…leaving very little room for any traditional style artist to chart anymore.

    Carrie’s supporters say we are too narrow in our definition of Country. But Carrie’s brand of it, leaves very little room for anything else, especially the more traditonal sound. So much for the broad umbrella.”

    This is a valid complaint – the only issue I take with it is when it’s directly attributed to Carrie or her supporters. I think it’s a little unfair to paint Carrie’s supporters (or Carrie for that matter) as people who both (A) support pop/contemporary country music and nothing else and (B) wish that the industry would only support pop/contemporary country music and nothing else. I certainly don’t fall into this category. I love Carrie right along with Loretta Lynn and Connie Smith.

    “And again, we are not the only ones…Connie Smith’s criticicms of modern country are even stronger than some of Loretta’s..check out her interview on My Kind of Country.”

    I’m fully aware, and I respect their opinions – but I’ve found that more than a handful of such traditional artists have been able to point out a few things or even artists they like in mainstream country music (like Loretta), which I find admirable. That’s my point. With the kind of impenetrable declarations some traditional fans have made on this thread, you wonder if they can see past what they’re saying. Just like they wonder if the enthused Carrie fans can see past Carrie.

    “So I hope you can understand anyway where we are coming from. Though our tastes differ, I always considered you a fair minded person.”

    I absolutely understand, and I do appreciate your opinion and those of people I don’t agree with who are willing to have a rational discussion, because it allows me to grow as a fan of music.

  361. Leeann Ward
    September 9, 2009 at 10:15 am

    I guess I should rephrase. I don’t consider her a queen of country music while others clearly do. That’s fine though. I don’t always have to agree. I like her music a lot (one of my favorite female artists) and she sure has left an indelible impression on country music, but she’s not the queen of it in my book. I don’t want to make this hopping thread about Patty though.

  362. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 10:19 am

    Thanks Tara, and I (we) know of many people who share your appreciation of both pop and traditonal country, and the champions of both.

  363. Dan
    September 9, 2009 at 10:22 am

    2009 CMA Awards Nominations:

    Carrie Underwood was nominated for:

    1. female vocalist
    2. musical event – I Told You So (Carrie & Randy)

    I Told You So was also nominated for Song of the Year.

  364. Leeann Ward
    September 9, 2009 at 10:44 am

    Dan,
    Are you just trying to add fuel to this fire now?:)

    Just want to clarify that I just don’t think “queen of country music” should be used loosely. Kitty Wells is considered the queen of country music due to her very long history. She’s still alive, so I don’t think she’s been dethroned just yet…by anyone. For that matter, I wouldn’t even call Reba the queen of country music at this point either, now that I think about it.

  365. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 11:25 am

    From a recent interview with Patty Loveless:

    (Country Universe)
    Obviously, country radio has changed in the last 10-15 years, and you’ve enjoyed a number of successes in the format. To which artists of this new generation do you gravitate?
    (Patty Loveless)
    (pauses) I think Carrie Underwood has an amazing voice. She can do some hard-core country. I saw her at the Opry sing a real traditional country song, and I think that’s something she can do. She did a wonderful job.
    (Country Universe)
    Back to Carrie Underwood, you’ve obviously gained the respect of the younger generation of artists, because she sent a personal message on her website that she’d be buying the record in the store even though she had the opportunity, of course, to receive an advance copy.
    (Patty Loveless)
    That’s really nice of her. She has a lot of talent. I love that experience, too. One thing I’ve always done is go out and buy my own record in the stores. Of course, I didn’t make it out on Tuesday with everything going on, but I always like to go buy the record and then maybe buy something else from some other artists I’m interested in.

  366. Jon
    September 9, 2009 at 11:44 am

    Leeann: “Just want to clarify that I just don’t think “queen of country music” should be used loosely. Kitty Wells is considered the queen of country music due to her very long history. She’s still alive, so I don’t think she’s been dethroned just yet…by anyone.”

    Yep.

  367. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 11:48 am

    I do appreciate Carrie’s kind words for Patty’s music. I just wish her appreciation of would show more in the majority of her work. Carrie’s music for the most part shows very little influence from Patty or the more traditional artists. With some exceptions, of course, like I Told You So, and her rendition of Stand By Your Man, which is the song I think Patty was alluding to in her comments.

    And if you read Patty’s words carefully, you’ll see that her praise was very specific, relating to Carrie’s ablility to sing a great Traditional “hard core country” song, it is not necessarily an endorsement of Carrie’s pop style style in a general sense.

    The kind words for Patty notwithstanding, Carrie’s work shows a far greater influence from Shania, Faith, and Martina.

  368. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 12:01 pm

    “… Kitty Wells is considered the queen of country music due to her very long history. She’s still alive, so I don’t think she’s been dethroned just yet…by anyone.”

    Yep.

    Good point, I’m just saying the ladies I listed are worthy heirs, and are queens of country in their own right, and in their own way. They also have much more in common with Kitty Wells than Carrie Underwood does. But if there is only ONE Queen, it’s hard to argue with that designation for Kitty Wells.

  369. Phil
    September 9, 2009 at 12:05 pm

    All I know is, I have nothing personal against Carrie (or Taylor). They can sing anything they want. And if Country Music Radio decides to play it…well, I guess that makes it Country (even if money is the only reason).
    But I’m not going to sit here and give them more credit than they deserve for what they were designed for by the Industry to begin with either. As I said, the problem I have with today’s mainstream music in general is that it is all about who the “Artist” is as a “Person”, rather than who the “Person” is as an “Artist”. I will give them both credit for being in the right place at the right time though. Time will tell how Carrie will be remembered 30 or 40 years from now. Maybe people will be arguing over how much better the music was back in the American Idol day, and how things were so much better when Carrie was around. Who knows.
    And if my opinions come off as fact, that is only because that is how one chooses to read them.

  370. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 12:15 pm

    ‘”….. I don’t consider her a queen of country music while others clearly do. That’s fine though. I don’t always have to agree. I like her music a lot (one of my favorite female artists) and she sure has left an indelible impression on country music, but she’s not the queen of it in my book…”

    Those are still awesome things you say about Patty, Leeann. :)

    “..while others clearly do…”

    Thank you.

    Even I didn’t say Patty was the only one. She is in my book, but I respect the opinion of others to the contrary.

    My point in all this was that Carrie has not earned the title, by any measure of creative or artistic achievement. And the fact that some fans and even apparently one journalist are calling her the Queen is symptomatic of the whole distorting effect of irrational “Carriemania” (not to be confused with rational, sane appreciation of Carrie and her music.)

  371. Stormy Lewis
    September 9, 2009 at 12:27 pm

    The problem is that Carrie’s words about country music are just lip serivice until she backs them up with some actions.

  372. Blake Boldt
    September 9, 2009 at 12:30 pm

    In the Loveless interview, she praised Carrie’s singing ability, specifically tied to her more-traditional offerings and performances at the Opry. The passage in between the Carrie comments, which was omitted in Texasvet’s post, spoke about newer artists and their “settling” for current trends in order to make a dollar without incorporating the trademark sounds of the genre. That’s my main beef with Carrie; her voice is clearly good-to-very-good, but the material is lacking all too often.

  373. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 12:36 pm

    Blakes’ interview with Patty by the way, is excellent, one of the best I’ve ever read.

  374. Steve from Boston
    September 9, 2009 at 12:47 pm
  375. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 1:17 pm

    Sorry about that Blake. For brevity I only posted the parts that directly pertained to Carrie although in hindsight I should have included a link to the whole interview like Steve did.

  376. Blake Boldt
    September 9, 2009 at 1:25 pm

    Don’t mention it. Having Patty Loveless note Carrie for her talent, specifically her voice is a ringing endorsement, and I’m sure she wishes the best for Carrie in the future. But I also think Carrie, a good-to-very-good vocalist, needs to shore up her musical decision-making before she’s considered a truly great artist.

  377. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 1:33 pm

    “But I also think Carrie, a good-to-very-good vocalist, needs to shore up her musical decision-making before she’s considered a truly great artist.”

    100% in agreement with that statement.
    Folks need to keep in mind that CC is the first single and we don’t know what the rest of the album contains.

  378. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 1:51 pm

    You know why I don’t respect Underwood, Swift and others of their ilk? If they were flat chested and had big butts, would anyone heard of them? Winning American idol has little to do with musical ability-its a glorified karaoke contest. They gain fame without actually learning their craft and never bother do so.

  379. Tom
    September 9, 2009 at 2:13 pm

    the old tits and ass story all over again.

  380. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 2:20 pm

    Steve M.

    If you would have bothered to read through the previous 377 posts you’d know that AI, learning craft and paying dues has already been discussed ad nauseum.

  381. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 2:23 pm

    Kelly Clarkson is flat chested with a big butt and she’s done quite well for herself.

    Kelly Clarkson quote from USA Today:
    – If you missed Kelly Clarkson’s segment in the made-for-cable back-to-school special Get Schooled: It’s Your Right that ran last night, you can watch it here. But the Kelly Clarkson Quote of the Day come from another source, Heat. “I totally have no chest, I’m all butt,” Kelly tells the British magazine. “I’m a fan of my butt.”

  382. Stormy Lewis
    September 9, 2009 at 2:31 pm

    And, I hate to say this, Taylor herself if not especially endowed. Though she might to better if she ate a cheeseburger occassionally.

  383. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 2:36 pm

    Is Stormy & Stormy Lewis the same person? Just asking.

  384. Tom
    September 9, 2009 at 2:38 pm

    ….nothing beats an intelligent and eloquent woman.

  385. Stormy Lewis
    September 9, 2009 at 3:04 pm

    Texasvet: Yes, I apparently saved Stormy Lewis at work.

  386. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 3:17 pm

    If Carrie Underwood looked like Rosanne Barr or the woman from Great Britain whose name escapes at the moment, who anyone listen? Would GAC and CMTV play her videos? Come on, could a Janis Joplin make it now? Hell no.

  387. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 3:18 pm

    And for the record, who gives a damn what a Kelly Clarkson says? If Emmylou Harris said something similar I might listen, but another made-up star? No thanks.

  388. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 3:34 pm

    Or,
    If Patty Loveless, Reba, Dolly or any other country star looked like Rosanne Barr or Susan Boyle (who is from Scotland by the way) would anyone listen?

  389. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 3:35 pm

    “And for the record, who gives a damn what a Kelly Clarkson says?”

    Who gives a damn that you don’t give a damn??

  390. Razor X
    September 9, 2009 at 6:23 pm

    If Patty Loveless, Reba, Dolly or any other country star looked like Rosanne Barr or Susan Boyle (who is from Scotland by the way) would anyone listen?

    Probably not. And Scotland is part of Great Britain, by the way.

  391. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 6:34 pm

    “And Scotland is part of Great Britain, by the way.”

    No kidding, I was just being more specific.

  392. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 6:40 pm

    From Billboard: http://www.billboard.com/column/chartbeat/chart-beat-wednesday-carrie-underwood-kings-1004010621.story#/column/chartbeat/chart-beat-wednesday-carrie-underwood-kings-1004010621.story

    Carrie Underwood collects the highest debut by a female artist this year on Country Songs, as “Cowboy Casanova” ropes a No. 26 start. Among all acts, Underwood’s new hit ties Brad Paisley’s “Then” for the year’s second-best bow on Country Songs. Kenny Chesney’s “Out Last Night” began at No. 25 on the April 11, chart.

    Dating to the conversion of Country Songs to Nielsen BDS-monitored data on the chart dated Jan. 20, 1990, “Cowboy Casanova” logs the fifth-best entrance for a song by a female artist. And look who has the highest:

    No. 20, “So Small,” Carrie Underwood (2007)
    No. 21, “All Jacked Up,” Gretchen Wilson (2005)
    No. 24, “I’m Gonna Getcha Good!,” Shania Twain (2002)
    No. 25, “Love Story,” Taylor Swift (2008)
    No. 26, “Cowboy Casanova,” Carrie Underwood (2009)

  393. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 6:49 pm

    What a prestigious list. Why all those artists rank up there with Hank Williams, Patsy Cline and Johnny Cash.

  394. Razor X
    September 9, 2009 at 6:49 pm

    What’s really interesting is that not one of those songs is any good.

  395. TexasVet
    September 9, 2009 at 6:58 pm

    “What a prestigious list. Why all those artists rank up there with Hank Williams, Patsy Cline and Johnny Cash.”

    Not…but other then Loretta, who does?

    I

  396. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 7:02 pm

    You seem to be laboring under the delusion that popularity equates with quality. There is an Olive Garden in every city. That doesn’t make it the best Italian food in America.

  397. Tara Seetharam
    September 9, 2009 at 8:13 pm

    “You seem to be laboring under the delusion that popularity equates with quality. There is an Olive Garden in every city. That doesn’t make it the best Italian food in America.”

    Actually, you seem to be laboring under the delusion that popularity equates with quality. I’m curious what all you know about Kelly Clarkson and her music? I’m going to jump the gun and assume you know her only as a reality competition winner, in which case you’ve made the exact same assumption that you think Texasvet made. Funny, isn’t it?

    “As I said, the problem I have with today’s mainstream music in general is that it is all about who the “Artist” is as a “Person”, rather than who the “Person” is as an “Artist”.”

    This seems to be a recurrent theme with this discussion, and I find it fascinating (no sarcasm). I understand your argument, but I think there’s something to be said for understanding an artist as a person before understanding an artist as an artist – so long as you don’t end up basing your opinion of his or her music solely on personality or character. We’ll never personally know these artists (or most of us won’t), but having an understanding of who they are, what they believe in and what’s important to them gives you, I think, a deeper understanding of their music.

  398. kevin w
    September 9, 2009 at 8:26 pm

    “What’s really interesting is that not one of those songs is any good.”

    Opinion presented as gospel

  399. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 8:35 pm

    So, to extend the analogy, if I get to know the life story of Tony the cook, Annette the waitress and Juan the busboy, I will appreciate the food of Olive Garden more?
    Just like I don’t want to know what goes into my hot dog, I don’t want to know what goes into mediocre music.

  400. Tara Seetharam
    September 9, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    Yep, you just might. I don’t think that’s a ridiculous concept. For the record, I’m talking about all artists – from bad to great.

  401. Jon
    September 9, 2009 at 9:44 pm

    I hate food-music analogies. Talk about a lack of quality…

  402. Dan
    September 9, 2009 at 9:56 pm

    This song is yet another well deserved hit for Carrie. If her album is as good as this first hit single, we’ll see and hear many wonderful things from this album for the next two years (just in time for a fourth cd)!

    *Awesome debut numbers for “Cowboy Casanova”

  403. Steve M.
    September 9, 2009 at 10:21 pm

    So Dan is it safe to say you a record company shill?

  404. Stormy
    September 9, 2009 at 10:24 pm

    Dan–The song is bad, but she doesn’t deserve to be hit.

  405. Dan
    September 9, 2009 at 10:56 pm

    Steve M. – Think what you want Cowboy.

    Stormy – Don’t you worry. Any “hits” toward Carrie don’t matter at all because none of them affect her. Her sales numbers are much stronger. Now you can have a good night’s rest.

  406. kevin w
    September 9, 2009 at 11:12 pm

    “Just like I don’t want to know what goes into my hot dog, I don’t want to know what goes into mediocre music”

    Maybe some talent? Shocking I know, but there maybe some talent behind that music.

  407. Phil
    September 10, 2009 at 12:42 am

    As I said, the problem I have with today’s mainstream music in general is that it is all about who the “Artist” is as a “Person”, rather than who the “Person” is as an “Artist”.”

    This seems to be a recurrent theme with this discussion, and I find it fascinating (no sarcasm). I understand your argument, but I think there’s something to be said for understanding an artist as a person before understanding an artist as an artist – so long as you don’t end up basing your opinion of his or her music solely on personality or character. We’ll never personally know these artists (or most of us won’t), but having an understanding of who they are, what they believe in and what’s important to them gives you, I think, a deeper understanding of their music.

    Actually what I meant by that was more about the actual songs they sing are more about who they are as a person rather than who they are as an artist. I don’t mind an artist singing about something that is personal to him or her…that is how it has always been. But when you have to actually know or like the singer personally to connect with the song or relate to it…that is the problem I have. Take for example George Strait’s “Troubadour” or Taylor Swift’s latest single “Fifteen” or Toby Keith’s “I’m Not As Good As I Once Was”. It’s all about who they are as a person. Compare that to almost any Garth Brooks song…”Callin Batonrouge” or “The Thunder Rolls” as examples, or even Dolly Parton’s “Coat Of Many Colors”. Those are both personal songs to them, but anybody can relate to them because they can put themselves in that situation rather than have to put themselves in the artists shoes to relate to it. That is the reason I don’t think today’s music will be remembered…it isn’t timeless because it is about the person singing it rather than the artist singing it. The person will one day die…the artist will live on forever. And 20 years from now who will remember Taylor Swift the person? That’s all I was trying to say.

    Most of the music I like, I wasn’t even born yet or was too young to have ever known who the person was singing it. But I could relate to it because it was about the Artist and not the person that artist was. It was timeless because the person singing it let the listener put themselves in the situation, rather than making the listener put themselves in the shoes of the person who was singing the song.

  408. Phil
    September 10, 2009 at 4:07 am

    Anyway…to me the mark of a good song is one that is timeless and will be relateable and relevant to the listener 20 years/even 50 years later. And I would say most of today’s music has the shelf life of a banana because it is all about who the actual “person” singing it is, rather than who the actual “artist” is singing it in most cases. Yes, it may be relateable to the listener at the moment, but won’t be in future years from now when that person is no longer here.
    So I guess time will tell how today’s music and the artists that these labels are creating are remembered in 20 years, let alone 50…I’ve already forgotten about most of the music…we’ll see about the artists. And that is why I can say that today’s music and artists cannot even compare to the music and artists of the past.

  409. Tara Seetharam
    September 10, 2009 at 8:49 am

    “Anyway…to me the mark of a good song is one that is timeless and will be relateable and relevant to the listener 20 years/even 50 years later. And I would say most of today’s music has the shelf life of a banana because it is all about who the actual “person” singing it is, rather than who the actual “artist” is singing it in most cases. Yes, it may be relateable to the listener at the moment, but won’t be in future years from now when that person is no longer here.”

    I wholeheartedly disagree, but this is another discussion all together.

  410. Phil
    September 10, 2009 at 12:03 pm

    That’s fine that you disagree, and it is another discussion all together. But time will tell how future generations will relate to and remember the mainstream music of today and the artists that are being created by the Industry.

  411. Bill
    September 10, 2009 at 6:03 pm

    Jim Malec. My grandmother had an old fashioned recipe for removing ear wax from your ears and I’ll be glad to share that with you if you want. Seriously, it worked on me many times as a child. It always felt good to get that excess wax build up out of my ears. That’s what you must be suffering from. You are suffering from something to write the review you wrote on Carrie’s new song, Cowboy Casanova. You obviously didn’t hear it! Get your ears checked Jim. This song is great! It’s different (how can anyone compare Carrie to Shania? They are two different people and their music has very different sounds. Shania always went in for the techno music back-up, Carrie makes much more use of the steel guitar, drums…typical country instruments. But, that’s right. You didn’t hear any of this because of your wax build up. And, SERIOUSLY, you need to look at your objectivity when you write about Carrie. What has the girl done to you? Did she refuse to go out with you? Hurt your pride? What’s the deal? She can’t get a fair shake from you. Oh well, it doesn’t matter. The majority of readers think your opinion is irrelevant anyway. Country music fans are going to support Carrie – in fact – I see another #1 on her hands. Crank it up boys, I love that beat. Let me hear it for the 6,000th time!

  412. merlefan49
    September 10, 2009 at 6:14 pm

    Guess I have wax in my ears too cause I think the song is bad. I guess the wax acts as a filter so I’d hate to hear it without it.

  413. Bill
    September 10, 2009 at 6:16 pm

    You are entitled to your opinion – however misguided.

  414. Jon
    September 10, 2009 at 6:22 pm

    “You are entitled to your opinion – however misguided.”

    You can’t get more generous than that!

  415. merlefan49
    September 10, 2009 at 6:29 pm

    Why my opinion misguided anymore that yours?

  416. Steve Harvey
    September 10, 2009 at 8:24 pm

    The amount of comments on this article makes Baby Jesus cry.

    Especially when we could really break them down to five posts:

    1. HATERS SUC!K@$!!
    2. Carrie Underwood is a no-talent hack.
    3. Meh.
    4. Who’s on first – Jon
    5. I don’t know who’s on third – Jim Malec

    There we go, no need for further discussion.

  417. Jim Malec
    September 10, 2009 at 8:44 pm

    @Steve–

    You’ll notice I abandoned this discussion when the train hit crazy town a couple of days ago.

  418. Leeann Ward
    September 10, 2009 at 9:07 pm

    Ha, Jim. You technically started all of this by daring to write the review in the first place. I kid, I kid. Somebody had to do it.

  419. Wade
    September 10, 2009 at 9:46 pm

    LeeAnn, yeah somebody did have to do it, but i feel bad for Jim beause that meant he actualy had to listen to the song. HAHA

  420. Todd
    September 10, 2009 at 11:58 pm

    Wow I guess I’m a little (ok a lot) late to the party on this one!

    I guess you could classify me as part of the I don’t understand how this is country crowd.The token steel, some fiddle and the word cowboy in the title does not make this song country in the least. I really wish someone could come up with a response to the question why is this song country other than it’s being played on Country Radio, because I really want to know if I’m missing something.

    If country radio had any integrity left this song would never be a hit (there’s no chance of that happening since the radio industry lost it’s integrity long ago). On the bright side for Carrie and her fans this song should be a massive pop hit no remix necessary, which for some reason they seem to hate.

  421. Vance
    September 11, 2009 at 11:56 am

    The Opry won’t like Cowboy Casanova and it could lead to Carie’s expulsion if her second single isn’t more country and of considerable higher quality.

  422. M.C.
    September 11, 2009 at 12:58 pm

    Vance–Underwood would have to be charged with a capital crime for the Opry to drop her at this point. She’s far too big of a draw at a time when the Opry struggles to sell tickets.

    Without having read every entry here, has anyone considered that “Cowboy Casanova” may have been insipired by her previous romance with a famous football Cowboy now known for breaking the hearts of pop starlets? And chosen as a single to coincide with the start of football season?

  423. Jon
    September 11, 2009 at 2:38 pm

    “The Opry won’t like Cowboy Casanova and it could lead to Carie’s expulsion if her second single isn’t more country and of considerable higher quality.”

    You gotta be kidding.

  424. Joseph
    September 12, 2009 at 6:26 am

    Sorry if Im an ignoramus, but has anybody actually been expelled from the The Opry?(im not being sarcastic, im just curious)

    “a famous football Cowboy now known for breaking the hearts of pop starlets?” “That guy” dosen have blue eyes right? (maybe it could have been written recently around July 10 this year?)

    This song is quite average in my opinion, it probably will be a crossover hit, looking at her previous success. A lot less country than Carnival Ride (but I don really mind)

    P.S.Can it be classified under “Pop rock” instead? because that was what wikipedia put until it was replaced with “country”

  425. Occasional Hope
    September 12, 2009 at 7:36 am

    Hank Williams was (famously) expelled.

  426. Wade
    September 14, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    “The Opry won’t like Cowboy Casanova and it could lead to Carie’s expulsion if her second single isn’t more country and of considerable higher quality.”

    Right, because they will kick people out for making a crummy pop song….We couldnt get that lucky..

  427. This song hurts my ears
    September 17, 2009 at 12:08 pm

    Delusional Carrie fans apparently feel it’s OK to spam hundreds of country stations’ program directors and DJs with requests claiming they live in those stations’listening area.

    Or to hit those same people with hate mail about other female country artists.

    But how dare someone write something coherent and thoughtful that dares to criticize even one song!

    The simple truth is that this song doesn’t even qualify as an awful country song. There’s nothing country about it. Even the title is a reference to a football player.

    I think Jim was being kind.

  428. TexasVet
    September 17, 2009 at 1:18 pm

    “Delusional Carrie fans apparently feel it’s OK to spam hundreds of country stations’ program directors and DJs with requests claiming they live in those stations’listening area.”

    Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!
    I guess that’s never been done before…you sound like the delusional fan of some other artist. Maybe you should change your name to NOTHING BETWEEN THE EARS!

    By the way, CC is #17 already so I guess her fans are doing a great job of spamming! LOL!

    http://www.mediabase.com/mmrweb/insideradio/charts.asp?format=11&showyear=y&dpt=n

  429. Johnny Paycheck
    September 17, 2009 at 2:48 pm

    It’s never been done before by such a focused group of hate-mongers, that’s for sure. I’ve seen a lot of crazed fans and fan bases, but as Kanye West would say, Yo, all you other artist’s fans are crazy, but Carrie fans are some of the meanest, most spiteful organization of hatemongers of all time. All Time!!

  430. K
    September 17, 2009 at 4:32 pm

    “It’s never been done before by such a focused group of hate-mongers, that’s for sure. I’ve seen a lot of crazed fans and fan bases, but as Kanye West would say, Yo, all you other artist’s fans are crazy, but Carrie fans are some of the meanest, most spiteful organization of hatemongers of all time. All Time!!”

    And you know this how? Not all Carrie fans are rude, obsessed, or hateful. I happen to find it disgusting how tons of non-Carrie fans seem group us sane, nice fans in with the crazy, rude ones.

    Even if a lot of Carrie’s fans are rude, what does that do to you? It doesn’t mean they are spiteful or rude in real life. I know that doesn’t justify rudeness in any form, but think of it as the “you-don’t-act-the-same-way-around your-mother- as-you do-your-best friend” priniciple.

    I’ve ran across many Carrie fans, and have NEVER gotten a rude response.

    Many of her fans get defensive, yes, but that doesn’t mean they won’t listen to opinions or respect others in any way.

  431. TexasVet
    September 17, 2009 at 5:22 pm

    “It’s never been done before by such a focused group of hate-mongers, that’s for sure.”

    Well to paraphrase the real Johnny Paycheck…you can take your opinion and shove it!

  432. Steve Harvey
    September 17, 2009 at 7:30 pm

    432 comments! Aaargh!

  433. shannon
    September 18, 2009 at 12:01 am

    Can we just get to the real point of this song? Tony Romo anyone????

  434. Flatbroke
    September 20, 2009 at 6:07 pm

    I love Carrie but this song is fluff. Look at her performance of “I know you won’t” on the 09 peoples choice awards .That song has substance and Carrie nailed it with a vocal performance that rivals anyone in any genre. That is the type of performance and song combo that takes singers from good to legendary. Cowboy Casanova doesn’t have what it takes to stand the test of time , it is targeted to hit #1 for the sake of hitting #1.I look forward to the day Carrie sings another song with substance.

  435. Fadi H.
    September 21, 2009 at 4:09 am

    Ok don’t get me wrong, I do like Carrie’s voice and I really think that she has potential to take country music to another level. BUT, i think that she’s very far from that now. Carrie Underwood has one of the strongest young voices of all genres, but her song choice leaves her as a talented young woman who MIGHT leave a mark, but isn’t there yet. I wrote before that if Carrie really cared about country music, she would use her talent and her popularity to present real traditional hardcore country on her third album, but from the looks of it, Carrie (or her producers) are more interested in instant success rather than presenting something memorable.
    Cowboy Casanova isn’t a bad song, I would give it a thumbs up coz it’s fun, but it’s not as awesome as some people are trying to portray it. I would listen to it if it shows up in my Party Shuffle, but i wouldn’t necessarily add it to any of my heavy played playlists coz it’s too ordinary for that.

  436. Stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 6:46 am

    What level is she going to take country music to that it hasn’t already been?

  437. Tom
    September 21, 2009 at 6:56 am

    …is the question to strong or the answers to weak?

  438. Steve M.
    September 21, 2009 at 8:41 am

    The level I believe you are looking for is the sub-basement, where they store the artifacts of 90s pop she is ripping off.

  439. Casey
    September 21, 2009 at 8:48 am

    The 9513 RARELY gives Carrie positive reviews, and I really don’t get it. This is like a candy coated version of “Carrie we know you can sing, but we don’t get why you’re successful.”

    Carrie is one of the most talented country artists of the decade. Honestly, she’s got bigger pipes than almost all artists today. No one can hold a note as long as Carrie, not even Martina.

    Martina has definitely lost her edge, as can be proved by her recent releases. That’s where Carrie takes it all. Single releases. Almost EVERY song went to number 1, with the exception of 2 songs that went to number 2. No one else makes as many hits as Carrie right now. Not even Taylor Swift.

    Carrie will continue to make hits, and this song is no different. It’ll be a huge hit.

  440. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 8:52 am

    But how much of that is because this is a pretty sorry decade for mainstream country.

  441. Casey
    September 21, 2009 at 8:52 am

    Plus, Carrie’s good at these sassy fun songs. Before this she released ‘Just a Dream’ and ‘I Told You So’ so I think it was time for another upbeat Carrie song. It’ll definitely get people interested in the album.

  442. Casey
    September 21, 2009 at 8:55 am

    Mainstream Country is doing pretty well for itself. Despite the fact that Taylor Swift is mostly pop music, she’s still considered in the Country category. She brings in a lot of younger fans. Artists like Lady Antebellum are almost universal in terms of musical stylings. They’re not heavily country.

    To me, Country music is at it’s best right now because more people can get into it. The heavy twang that it used to have drives people away. Carrie, Taylor, Keith, Rascal Flatts, and the like are the pioneers in modern country music and they’re the cause of its popularity at the moment.

  443. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 9:18 am

    Mainstream country is at one of its all time lows in popularity at the moment.

  444. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 9:34 am

    “Mainstream country is at one of its all time lows in popularity at the moment.”

    As measured by what?

  445. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 9:35 am

    “Carrie is one of the most talented country artists of the decade. Honestly, she’s got bigger pipes than almost all artists today. No one can hold a note as long as Carrie, not even Martina.”

    That seems an odd standard for vocal talent.

  446. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 9:44 am

    Jon: As measured by RIAA listenership shares.

  447. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 10:06 am

    “Jon: As measured by RIAA listenership shares.”

    That’s gibberish.

  448. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 10:32 am

    Jon: No its not. If you read the RIAA trend surveys they list what percentage of the total ammount of music purchased and listened to it from each genre.

  449. Dan
    September 21, 2009 at 11:09 am

    I definitely agree with Casey. This is a great decade for Country music. Carrie and Taylor plus countless others are fresh, fun, and proving themselves over and over again with each new song released.

    The two songs that didn’t go number 1 in the us both went number 1 in Canada. So, Carrie hasn’t messed up yet. “Cowboy Casanova” is already at #13 on the country songs chart!

    *Carrie’s music video for this song will premier on October 2nd. (I hear it’s going to be amazing!)

  450. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 11:16 am

    In the first place, the RIAA doesn’t deal with “listenership shares,” which is why your original statement was gibberish. They deal with information about recorded product shipments – a fact you have pointed out many times when you’ve been seeking to discredit gold/platinum/diamond certifications.

    Secondly, and more importantly, a look at the historical data from the RIAA about product shipments shows that the country music percentage is NOT “at one of its all time lows in popularity at the moment.” The RIAA’s data go back to 1973, and they show the country share of shipments “at the moment” to be right in the middle of the pack for the last decade and for the 80s, and at the upper end of the range of shares in the 70s. It compares poorly only to the early-mid 90s, when share was at an historic high thanks to an earlier generation of pop-leaning artists with mass appeal, like Garth Brooks and Shania Twain.

    And by the way, the same is generally true with respect to country radio; it’s done better a couple of times in the past relative to other formats, but it’s mostly done worse or the same.

    It really helps to put aside your biases and preferences when looking at the data – and to know what the data are to begin with.

  451. Steve M.
    September 21, 2009 at 11:17 am

    I love the comment about there being too much twang in country music before. If you don’t like twang, go back to boy bands and take Carrie Underwood, Taylor Swift and the others of their ilk with you.

  452. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 11:32 am

    Actually, country music was the second most listened to genre through most of the 80′s and only lost that position in the 1990′s-today.

  453. Chris N.
    September 21, 2009 at 11:39 am

    I think you may be talking about the recent CMA survey.

  454. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 11:51 am

    “Actually, country music was the second most listened to genre through most of the 80’s and only lost that position in the 1990’s-today.”

    According to what? “RIAA listenership shares?”

  455. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 12:25 pm

    Yes. Or if you prefer to call them percentages, you may call them that. I used to work in advertising and there its audience shares.

  456. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 12:29 pm

    “Yes. Or if you prefer to call them percentages, you may call them that. I used to work in advertising and there its audience shares.”

    The point is that the RIAA doesn’t publish “listener shares.” You’re just making them up. And their data on shipments/sales by genre don’t back up your statements, just as Arbitron’s radio listening data don’t back them up. It’s easy to talk yourself into thinking you have a strong argument if you’re just inventing figures as you go.

  457. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 12:48 pm

    They do publish trend surveys though, which is the same thing.

  458. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 12:53 pm

    “They do publish trend surveys though, which is the same thing.”

    Yeah, they do (though anyone with half a brain could tell you that “sales” and “listenership” are two different things). I already cited the information in them (“they show the country share of shipments “at the moment” to be right in the middle of the pack for the last decade and for the 80s, and at the upper end of the range of shares in the 70s. It compares poorly only to the early-mid 90s…” – something which you, though you refer to them, have yet to do. I’m guessing that’s because it doesn’t back up your statement.

  459. Razor X
    September 21, 2009 at 1:18 pm

    To me, Country music is at it’s best right now because more people can get into it. The heavy twang that it used to have drives people away. Carrie, Taylor, Keith, Rascal Flatts, and the like are the pioneers in modern country music and they’re the cause of its popularity at the moment.

    In other words, it’s better because it’s less country? Shouldn’t the goal be to try and attract new fans to country without changing the music beyond recognition?

  460. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 1:23 pm

    The mid 90′s compared poorly to the 1980′s when country music ranked #2 in listenership. Throughout the later half of the 90′s and most of this decade it has vacilated between #3 and #5.

  461. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 1:47 pm

    “The mid 90’s compared poorly to the 1980’s when country music ranked #2 in listenership. Throughout the later half of the 90’s and most of this decade it has vacilated between #3 and #5.”

    So you say, but you’re still apparently confused about the difference between sales (volume of recordings sold) and listenership (number of people listening). “Listenership” to what? CDs? Radio? Which document are you looking at, and where might we read it for ourselves?

    I note that in the RIAA’s 2008 Consumer Profile, which contains data on sales percentages for the last 10 years, your statement about “most of this decade” is not only arguably wrong, but actually advances the proposition that artists like Carrie Underwood and Taylor Swift are helping to resuscitate the genre’s standing. Here are the actual rankings:

    1999 – tied for 2nd; 2000 – 4th; 2001 – 5th; 2002 – 4th; 2003 – 4th; 2004 – 2nd; 2005 – 3rd; 2006 – 2nd; 2007 – 3rd; 2008 – 2nd.

    But really, why is a (purported) comparison to other individual genres more important than an evaluation of country’s percentage of total sales or total listening audience on its own?

    In the 1980s, country’s share of dollars spent on recorded music varied between 6.8% and 15%. Last year, it was 11.9%. (Sources: RIAA annual reports cited in _The Encyclopedia Of Country Music; RIAA 2008 Consumer Profile). If, as you contend, the 1980s were the peak for country’s “listenership” (whatever it is you mean by that), then how can a figure that’s pretty much in the middle of that range be “one of its all-time lows?” In fact, looking at the data between 1973 and 2008, 11.7% of sales is slightly above the norm.

  462. Chris N.
    September 21, 2009 at 2:03 pm

    Again, it really is best to just let him be right and walk away.

  463. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 2:19 pm

    Especially, if being 3rd and 4th is better than being 2nd.

  464. Razor X
    September 21, 2009 at 2:32 pm

    Again, it really is best to just let him be right and walk away.

    Since when has appeasement ever worked??

  465. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 2:33 pm

    Yeah, why let the facts get in the way of a good rant?

  466. Chris N.
    September 21, 2009 at 2:36 pm

    Are you comparing Jon to Hitler?

  467. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 2:56 pm

    Oy.

    There’s no point in pursuing a discussion over whether an artist or a piece of music is awesome or sucky. Likewise with whether it’s good or bad, high quality or dreck. There’s not much of a point in doing it over whether they’re country or not. But in my view (though apparently not Chris N.’s), statements that purport to be factual – quantitative ones; who wrote what; who played on what; etc. – are either true or not, verifiable by reference to reliable sources or not. And that’s worth exploring, at least for a little while. Though Stormy’s method of buttressing one confused, unsubstantiated claim by making another doesn’t offer much hope for its being a rational process.

  468. Razor X
    September 21, 2009 at 3:03 pm

    Are you comparing Jon to Hitler?

    No, I wouldn’t go that far. As far as I know, Jon isn’t a genocidal maniac. I was thinking something more along the lines of a toddler throwing temper tantrums for attention.

  469. Jack
    September 21, 2009 at 3:04 pm

    I can’t believe this thread is still going! A little song by Carrie sets some sort of record for 9513 site hits it seems. The 9513 should love Carrie since she generates lots of income for them (based on site visits). Anyway, Cowboy Casanova after only a couple of weeks of airplay, is now on the brink of entering the Top 10 on country radio. Talk about a rocket ride up the charts!

  470. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 3:05 pm

    Jon: You’re numbers verified much of what I said.

  471. Jim Malec
    September 21, 2009 at 3:08 pm

    This has been a popular article, but comments aren’t necessarily indicative of “site visits” since only a TINY percentage of our readerships leaves comments.

  472. Chris N.
    September 21, 2009 at 3:27 pm

    “And that’s worth exploring, at least for a little while.”

    Like, all day? Nobody else I can think of puts so much energy and thought into trying to discover and expose the errors of others. You’d be a great copy editor.

  473. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 3:51 pm

    “Jon: You’re numbers verified much of what I said.”

    In Bizarro world, maybe. Here in the real world, they refute much of what you said (the part about country music being at one of its all-time lows at this moment – and the only part that remains unrefuted is the part for which you’ve offered no substantiation at all.

    Chris N., it doesn’t take much energy and thought at all. And I don’t spend any of it trying discover errors, I just react (sometimes) to the ones that present themselves in a particularly blatant form. Like this one.

  474. stormy
    September 21, 2009 at 4:07 pm

    Jon: I checked my fingers one more time and third place is still less than second.

  475. Jon
    September 21, 2009 at 4:21 pm

    A range of research methodologies that extends no further than from making things up to misunderstanding to counting your fingers is a little limited.

  476. Dan
    September 21, 2009 at 11:39 pm

    Mark your calendars! On September 30th, one of Carrie Underwood’s hit country songs will be performed on the fantastic show GLEE. Kristin Chenoweth (who just won an Emmy for the show Pushing Daisies)will be singing “Last Name”. Kristin is such a talented singer and will surely make Carrie proud.

    This will be awesome exposure for Carrie and will help “Cowboy Casanova” even more. This episode is perfect timing for Carrie since her music video will premier just a couple days after this show will air.

  477. ALJID
    September 22, 2009 at 12:13 am

    Will this thread ever die? Just asking…

  478. Flatbroke
    September 22, 2009 at 12:24 am

    After re reading the article , the comments and hearing the song a few more times i feel my comment “fluff” is a little weak.
    Part 1 and 2 stand on there own as a song . i don’t need a video or another part to understand what the song is about , part 3 needs parts 1 and 2 or a video to support it , “stay away from him , he’s a jerk” isn’t much of a story no matter who the story teller is.When i listen to cowboy casanova im thinking “her voice is great but this song-somthings missing” , it’s like they were so busy shoving words into it that they forgot to give them meaning , it makes me feel like they are trying to sell me the song with a riff here and an echo there. Nobody needed to “sell” me Patsy Cline singing Crazy , nobody needed to “sell” me Ann Wilson singing Crazy on you , nobody needs to “sell” me Carrie Underwood’s voice and nobody is going to sell me a turdcake no matter how many sprinkles they put on it,
    To those that think Carrie is being treated unfairly i agree , but not by this article. From the time Carrie Underwood left the AI stage to present she has been compared to Ann Wilson,Patsy Cline,Martina Mcbride and Tammy Wynette , nobody can live up to this , every time she releases a new single or even does a cover in concert another legend is shoved in her face . What other artist in the history of country music has been held to this standard ? What male artist is being compared to Marty Robbins or Hank Williams every time they sing?
    To those who feel Carrie Underwood and Taylor Swift should sing more mainstream country i ask , define mainstream . Is it Hank Williams who forever changed the face of country music with his guitar style ? or perhaps Marty Robbins who forever changed the face of country music by adding distortion? or Willie Nelson who wanted to sing his own songs , Hank jr. that did his dads songs his way? I could go on but don’t feel the need.

  479. Steve M.
    September 22, 2009 at 1:11 am

    How about Underwood and Swift take their teeny booper fans back to pop and let I don’t know, actual country music be played on the radio.

  480. Tom
    September 22, 2009 at 6:20 am

    kinda funny to find this totalitarion undertone in a thread about a song with the word cowboy in the title. are you sure, hank, would have wanted it that way, steve m.?

  481. stormy
    September 22, 2009 at 9:33 am

    I spoke with Hank in a seance last night–he is working on a celestial restriaining order enjoining all “new country” fans from envoking his name when defending their favorite bands.

  482. Tom
    September 22, 2009 at 10:17 am

    damnit, …and i thought i’d get away with it. next time the table starts moving give him my sincerest apology, will you.

  483. Flatbroke
    September 22, 2009 at 1:40 pm

    For the record my favorite bands are the Rolling Stones , the Eagles and Bob Seger and the Silver Bullet Band, favorite singers , Ann Wilson and Marty Robbins , Favorite guitar players Eric Clapton and Nancy Wilson. If a song is good i don’t care is the label says country , rock or pop.

  484. Max
    September 24, 2009 at 5:06 pm

    This song is “Rock & Roll Part II” meets Whitney Houston’s “I’m Your Baby Tonight.”

    I do think it’s cute, though.

  485. Dan
    September 25, 2009 at 12:15 am

    “Cowboy Casanova” is the fastest rising single in Carrie Underwood’s career.
    It is already at #11 on Country Songs. It has also just debuted on the Hot 100 at #96.

    This song is looking like it might end up being the hottest country song of the year!

  486. Thomas
    September 25, 2009 at 3:39 am

    …just a dream.

  487. Phil
    September 25, 2009 at 4:31 am

    Cool…the faster it gets to the top, the sooner it will be forgotten.

  488. Dan
    September 25, 2009 at 8:45 am

    Phil – as much as you would like to believe otherwise, none of Carrie’s massive singles have been forgotten and neither will this song.

  489. Phil
    September 25, 2009 at 12:25 pm

    OK Dan, if that’s the case, how will this song and her other “massive singles” be remembered then in the annals of Country Music history when she’s gone?
    Either way, this song is nothing more than the “Cowboy Casanova” Carrie is warning all the females to stay away from in the first place. It’s a candy coated package designed to deceive, and once it is opened up you will find there is nothing inside but misery. I think it is very clever how the lyrics of this song are actually talking about itself the entire time.

  490. Steve M.
    September 25, 2009 at 12:57 pm

    Quick Dan, name all the #1′s Tiffany and Debbi Gibson had in the 80s? Can’t? Well the same will be true in twenty years with Underwood and Swift. They may have even posed in Playboy as well like Tiffany by then.

  491. Dan
    September 25, 2009 at 10:33 pm

    Phil: She’s already created a huge name for herself. Down the road (be it 20 years or later) her name will pop up as one of the greats that brought Country music to where it is right now. She’s a new leader into contemporary country and the annals of Country Music history will not soon forget that.

    Steve M.: I checked up on Tiffany and Debbi Gibson and they only had like 2 to 3 number 1′s each. Carrie already has up to 10 and Swift has racked up 4. Carrie and Taylor are not going to easily fade away. They are here for the long haul. Deal with it. In regard to your Playboy statement, keep dreaming.

  492. Razor X
    September 25, 2009 at 10:37 pm

    Down the road (be it 20 years or later) her name will pop up as one of the greats that brought Country music to where it is right now.

    You say that as if it were a good thing.

  493. Dan
    September 25, 2009 at 10:43 pm

    Razor X: I say that becasuse it’s a Great thing!

  494. Steve M.
    September 25, 2009 at 10:44 pm

    I would Elizabeth, whether singing or simply standing there, any day over these two blond airheads.

  495. Steve M.
    September 25, 2009 at 10:45 pm

    That should have read I would take Elizabeth Cook. That damn woman excites so much I can’t write a complete sentence.

  496. Razor X
    September 25, 2009 at 11:07 pm

    Razor X: I say that becasuse it’s a Great thing!

    OK, fine with me if you want to blame the sad state of mainstream country music on Carrie. I wouldn’t have laid the entire blame at her doorstep, but who am I to argue?

  497. Dan
    September 25, 2009 at 11:19 pm

    There’s nothing sad about where country music has gone to. If anything, it has livened up and put some energy into a genre that was rather boring.

  498. Stormy
    September 25, 2009 at 11:36 pm

    How is this song interesting?

  499. Phil
    September 26, 2009 at 12:36 am

    Yes Dan…Country Music finally left the seventies and is now well on its way to the eighties with the additions of Carrie (and Taylor). I thought living through it once was enough. But at least the eighties (and the Pop business model) gave more female artists a chance to succeed, so there was a little more variety back then (if you didn’t like Tiffany and Debbie Gibson you always had Madonna, Janet Jackson, Gloria Estefan, Paula Abdul, Taylor Dayne, Anita Baker, Martika, Bette Midler, Cher, Natalie Cole, Vanessa Williams, and Sheena Easton). The Country model does not. So right now we’re stuck with Carrie and Taylor (basically Debbie Gibson and Tiffany) until somebody else takes their places, or Country Music changes its business model. It will happen eventually when the Industry feels Carrie and Taylor have accomplished what they were set out to do in the first place (bring in a wider audience and create a fake popularity contest)…It will probably happen sooner than you think.
    Unfortunately the quality of what passes for music will probably not though…thanks to Taylor and Carrie and what the Industry has created by promoting them so hard, and the audience they are blatantly marketing to exclusively.
    And don’t even talk about the charts and how many #1 hits Carrie has…they are a complete joke if you have been following them like I have. I mean, Kellie Pickler’s song “Best Days Of Your Life” was on the chart you are talking about for 9 months before it finally hit the Top 10. Enough said.

  500. Dan
    September 26, 2009 at 12:46 am

    500 comments. 500 comments.

    Carrie Underwood is so popular and relevant to Country Music that both lovers and haters can’t stop talking about her.

    You rock Carrie. I and millions of other people, including Phil, can’t wait for your CD that comes out on November 3.

  501. Phil
    September 26, 2009 at 1:18 am

    What really irks me though based on the article in the New York Times “The New Face Of Country” is the Country Music Industry is intent on signing more artists to be like Carrie and Taylor (Debbie Gibson and Tiffany basically). They just don’t get it! I cannot believe what a bunch of dimwits are running the Industry. The last thing we need are any more Carrie and Taylor’s running around singing songs about bashing in ex-boyfriends cars, soldiers dying leaving the wife behind, All-American Girls, fairytales, highschool, and teen love. How about some variety and differentiation? Instead the “new” female artists are being relegated to singing songs that Carrie and Taylor have already done (ie. Kristy Lee Cook “15 Minutes Of Shame”…I thought I did an admirable job of defending that song. lol Jesse Lee “It’s A Girl Thing”, and Mallary Hope “Love Lives On, etc.)
    I just don’t understand what the Industry is thinking, and why so many female artists are intent on copying and basing there own careers on somebody else’s success. To me it seems fool hardy on both ends (the Industry and the new female country singers). The only good thing is there is only room for one Carrie and one Taylor at a time based on the business model Country Music employs. The bad news is there is room for little else. Especially if the new female country singers are being compromised by the Industry to copy Carrie and Taylor. They are capable of so much more than that.

  502. Phil
    September 26, 2009 at 1:21 am

    Dan, you’re right. I can’t wait ’til Carrie’s CD comes out on November 3….yet one more CD out of the hundreds that are released every year I won’t have to waste my money on.

  503. Dan
    September 27, 2009 at 9:01 pm

    The music video is finally out for “Cowboy Casanova.” Carrie’s team went all out for this and it looks amazing. She looks gorgeous in all her many outfits and she makes this video fun and interesting. She is starting her 3rd CD off with a bang and is certainly headed in the right direction. I loved the video!

  504. Steve M.
    September 27, 2009 at 9:38 pm

    Doesn’t bother just a little bit Dan that you keeping selling your soul piece by piece by hawking fluff? It must be a sad life being a record exec whose job is to cruise the internet pimping the flavor of the day.

  505. Dan
    September 27, 2009 at 11:00 pm

    Steve M. – I don’t know if you’ve heard yet, but the new music video from Carrie Underwood is out. I hope you are able to go to YouTube and check it out. I know you’ve been dying to catch a glimpse of it. Oh, when you’re there could you look for a tiny piece of soul. I think I might have lost it while helping to promote an artist I enjoy. Thanks and have a great day!

  506. K
    September 27, 2009 at 11:10 pm

    Steve,

    how is “Dan” “selling his soul” if he loves Carrie’s music and is not afraid to say it?

    You remind of the old hags that constantly pump up artists like Lynn and Jones without respecting that others like and enjoy current artists and (gasp!) the music that they are making.

    Not every song has to be “cryin in your beer” esqu.

    Carrie is an extremely talented artist and she HAS helped the genre move forward, whether you like it or not. She is one of the biggest country artists this decade, and she has secured her place in history.

    She is one of the few artists who actually has vocal talent in this decade. In an era of slick, autotuned and packaged stars, Carrie has showed what true vocal talent is.

    She has earned respect from legends who turn in a split second and criticize dozens of others for not having “real” talent like so many artists in the old days.

    She has earned her place in country music, and I think people should, at the very least, respect her talent as a brillant vocalist, regardless of other gripes you have with her or her artistry.

  507. Phil
    September 27, 2009 at 11:10 pm

    I think I’d rather read Dan’s comments than watch Carrie’s video or listen to her music. At least his comments are entertaining. That’s more than I can say for Carrie.

  508. Colt
    September 28, 2009 at 9:13 am

    Dan: “There’s nothing sad about where country music has gone to. If anything, it has livened up and put some energy into a genre that was rather boring.”

    Dan is right. I was tired of Merle and Johnny. This new era of Richard Marx infused Bananarama is very exciting.

  509. Steve M.
    September 28, 2009 at 10:10 am

    Colt, that is one of the funniest descriptions I have read. Thanks!

  510. Phil
    September 28, 2009 at 11:25 am

    Oh, and I did watch Carrie’s new video for “research” purposes. It proves my point that today it’s all about image and personality over creativity and substance (even if Carrie displays little of either). Even I could have come up with a better idea for the video. Instead, the entire video became all about Carrie and her many “outfits”, instead of focusing on the “Cowboy Casanova” which is what the song is supposedly about in the first place. And Carrie is the ACM “Entertainer Of The Year”? Well, those award shows are a joke in and of themselves anyway. Obviously.

  511. Steve M.
    September 28, 2009 at 11:36 am

    Phil, give up. Its useless to argue against a guy who either is a paid flak, or one who devotes so much attention and love toward this blond non-talent that he is close to a restraining order.

  512. Phil
    September 28, 2009 at 11:56 am

    Ahhh…I know, but this is more about today’s Entertainment Industry in general (and our narcissistic society’s lack of imagination and shallowness) than it is about any one person. I think the song and video is a very good example of it.
    Today, the “candy coated” package is the message. I can’t wait until people actually become curious enough to open up the package and find there is nothing inside (but misery). But maybe they should have taken Carrie’s advice and stayed away from it to begin with. It’s nothing but a disease and it is sweeping across our nation already though.
    What seems kind of funny to me (yet sad at the same time) is that Carrie seems to try to copy and be like Shania, and many of the new female artists try to copy and be like Carrie (or Taylor). No wonder nothing new and innovative gets created because of it. And no wonder Carrie and Taylor have no competition. It makes absolutely no logical sense to me.

  513. Dan
    September 28, 2009 at 12:26 pm

    Phil: You think you could come up with a better music video? Now that’s funny. Carrie’s video was beyond creative and fans are going to eat this up. You would have hated this video no matter what was put up anyway. The video’s ‘cowboy casanova’ fit in brilliantly. He was lurking in the shadows searching for his next prize. The showdown at the end between Carrie and the ‘Casanova’ was great.
    By the way, Carrie deserved Entertainer of the Year because she entertained the most during the year. Go Figure!

    Steve M. : I know you’re wasted and you’re feeling so small at the moment. You really should let Jesus take the wheel and start turning around from your cowboy casanova ways. Once you do I’m sure you’ll find your ever ever after right inside your home sweet home.

  514. Phil
    September 28, 2009 at 1:47 pm

    Thanks again for an entertaining comment Dan. you deserve the award for Entertainer Of The Year.
    And yes, I could have come up with a better video. I can think up at least 10 better scenarios off the top of my head. It goes to show the only purpose of this video was to showcase Carrie, and make it all about her, which made the actual “Cowboy Casanova” irrelevant to the song and the video. Go figure.

  515. Chris N.
    September 28, 2009 at 3:41 pm

    Reading this thread actually made me dumber.

  516. Flatbroke
    September 28, 2009 at 6:09 pm

    I’m sure you will all be happy to hear Carrie Underwood will receive the Nashville Symphony Harmony Award in december.

    Jim Malic:

    “Cowboy Casanova” will rack up airplay. It’ll drive sales. And it’ll provide a wonderful musical setting for her inevitable award show performances. But it won’t further Underwood’s position as an icon. And and it certainly won’t be remembered or beloved when her career’s sizzling status begins to simmer. Topical, uninteresting and unoriginal, it positions Underwood as an artist molded by the gears of the Nashville machine, as opposed to one with her own vision and who exists on a stage apart from her so-called competition.

    The same Nashville Machine that would make a young artist look at there Dixie Chicks collection and wonder if that can happen to them..you bet your ass it can.
    If a country singer can establish a pop music fan base it could be a pretty smart thing to do.

  517. Dan
    October 1, 2009 at 10:04 am

    Carrie Underwood takes a HUGE jump on the Hot 100 this week. “Cowboy Casanova” debuted at 96 last week and has moved 85 spots to #11 this week.

  518. arw
    October 2, 2009 at 1:14 am

    oh, c’mon….it’s rather juvenile to claim Carrie is without talent. Whether one chooses to admit it depends, I suppose, on their level of sophistication- which usually comes with age.

    Personally, I don’t like Cowboy Cassanova. Nor Last Name. Nor So Small. (And quite a few of her others.) Their just not the sound I enjoy be it lyrically, the production or in the melody. But so what? It doesn’t mean that I can’t recognize and appreciate a great vocalist. And, yes, Carrie is a great vocalist. It also doesn’t mean that I can’t be put off by her almost ‘to-mechanical’ approach to music.

  519. Evie
    October 2, 2009 at 10:58 am

    I just saw Carrie’s new video of “Cowboy Cassanova” and I was very proud of her. As someone who, along with millions of others, enjoyed her talent on American Idol, I have really enjoyed watching her grow as an artist. I have seen her perform emotionally charged songs, like “Just a Dream”, and just fun songs like “Before He Cheats” and CC, and love to see her grow more beautiful and comfortable as an artist. Regardless of what the usual bad mouthing “experts” say on this site, she is special and all the acccolades she’s received in this business prove it. She can sing any genre, and has, and all of them were top notch. There are many country artists who sing pop basically, like “This Kiss”, “Man I Feel Like a Woman”, etc. Those artists did well for themselves, so I think the Carrie haters should tame down the rhetoric a bit. Carrie is not the anichrist, so find someone else to viscerate.

  520. Phil
    October 2, 2009 at 11:21 am

    Yeah….I basically hear the same comments from Carrie supporters over and over again. I have nothing personal against Carrie (or Taylor) and I have made that point clear (although I don’t see or hear anything special about either). My beef is all on the Industry and what they have created. And please don’t even bother bringing up Carrie’s accocades and awards. I see right through them. And as for many of Carrie’s (and Taylor’s) fans..they speak for themselves. LOL

  521. stormy
    October 2, 2009 at 11:29 am

    Carrie can sing any genre. She has done enough in country for now and needs to work on her thrash metal for a while.

  522. Evie
    October 2, 2009 at 1:13 pm

    Stormy, I don’t know where all this animosity comes from, but it is disturbing. If you don’t like Carrie’s or Faith’s or Shania’s or Gloriana’s or Martina’s or Taylor’s kind or country music, so be it, don’t listen, turn the station. And Phil,don’t attack her fans just because they have a different opinion than you. Our opinion is as valid as yours. You make yourself sound intensely egotistical.

  523. Dan
    October 2, 2009 at 1:49 pm

    I agree with Evie that “Cowboy Casanova” is a very good music video. Her songs are great whether they’re emotional or just plain fun (which this particular song is).

    Phil: Ooh, you can now see through, I mean See Through, her awards. That is some powerful magic trick you have up your sleeves. Watch out Carrie, you have someone who can see through your awards.

    In all seriousness though, Phil, to discount her awards is childish. A lot of the awards she receives is fan voted. A lot of the awards she receives is not fan voted. The awards she gets clearly emphasizes that the majority of people love the direction in which she is going. Just because you are not in the majority doesn’t mean you can suddenly go blind and pretend that her awards mean nothing. Well, I guess you can, but it just makes you look foolish.

  524. Phil
    October 2, 2009 at 1:57 pm

    I rest my case. I don’t feel egotistical enough to even bother defending myself or my opinions. They are just that. My opinions.

  525. stormy
    October 2, 2009 at 2:26 pm

    Dan: Its not that hard to see through awards–that people’s choice one is made out of glass.

    Evie: That’s a joke. Like the one you didn’t get before.

  526. Phil
    October 2, 2009 at 2:55 pm

    And I don’t know if I was the only one who noticed it, but the Award Carrie won for CMA “Entertainer Of The Year”, which was voted by the fans, there was so much advertizing and campaigning done on Carrie’s behalf to see to it she won that award. I didn’t see any for the male artists who were up for nomination. For me, these award shows are basically nothing more than just a marketing and promotional tool used by the Industry to promote its artists and sell more music. That’s why I don’t take them seriously.

  527. Stewman
    October 2, 2009 at 3:19 pm

    To me Carrie actually has great potential and some of the songs on her first album were solid. I feel the cross over success of Before He Cheats could end up being a double edged sword. She now has to do these types of songs each album. “last name” was laughably bad, and this song isnt much better.
    I’d prefer sensible country pop to the Vegas-style antics of some these tracks.

  528. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 2:42 pm

    THE VIDEO IS GENIUS… THERE’S SOMETHING TO IT.. BUT ONLY THE REALLY GENIUS WILL GET IT FOR NOW…

    HAHA… I THINK CARRIE IS ONE SMART LADY… CARRIE YOU ARE A GENIUS… AND ALL THOSE WHO CAME UP WITH THIS… KUDO’S TO YOU ALL…

    LIKE I SAID, IT’S ABSOLUTELY GENIUS.. PERFECTION!!!!!!!! I GET IT TOTALLY… TEEHEE.. I WON’T SAY IT THO… TIME WILL DISCLOSE WHAT IT’S ALL ABOUT..

  529. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 2:52 pm

    A genius? Has she split the atom? Cured polio? Seems a bit much to toss the word around for an entertainer. If she gets a Phd in Astronomy like Brian May fron Queen, then maybe we can apply that tag.

  530. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 2:55 pm

    What it’s done is something similar, but using ET as a platform…yes….

    no, it’s not splitting the atom… but it sure splits apart some theories for sure… you’ll just have to cool your hells dude and you’ll find out..

  531. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 2:56 pm

    misspell.. heels… haha

  532. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 3:04 pm

    I am sorry, but I refuse to believe a glorified karaoke singer can be confused with a Nobel laureate.

  533. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 3:09 pm

    what she has to offer is so so much more useful in the society we live.. not to impune nobel winners, but his is not a competition involving them.. no!

    but I’m not going there anymore… she’s so much more than some karaoke singer… she’s for real.. and what she has to say can cure many from terrible mistakes…

    that’s about all I’m going there to say for now… you are negative and will never get it until it hits you on the head and you will too agree.. and say..

    yeah, true!!!!!

  534. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    If you can consider someone a genius, then no, i don’t want to know. If you believe she is a greater genius then a doctor, then its an indication of some odd priorities. A doctor can cure terrible mistakes. A singer, no so much.

  535. sam
    October 3, 2009 at 3:25 pm

    Carrie is a very talented singer and her talents are very valuable. But I see no sign that she is a genius or even that she has a particularly keen intellect. I respect Carrie for her talents, but as far as I can see, they are talents of the voice not of the mind.

  536. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 3:27 pm

    well, being a critical care nurse, I realize the importance of all doctors.. yes.. but I also see the fact that they make HUGE mistakes… I have seen countless mistakes they make, yes I have.. they are NOT genius.. not by a longshot.. try something else dude… heck, I’ve saved so many lives by fighting with doctors.. I think Carrie is doing the same thing in her profession.. fighting the naysayers.. yep… they think they know it all.. and they have 0 clue..

    yeah Carrie… just cuz someone has a degree, or experience it does not make them genius.. genius is someone who invents and see’s things others don’t see.. they can see thru those things that are as invisible as the wind to others.. doctors follow text books and research done by scientists… they don’t invent anything.. don’t create or change.. and are paid, to prescribe.. but it’s all coming to a stop thank god!!! they don’t think on their own.. think politics.. doctors are medical politicians… I could and can outdue them in an instant if I wanted to.. they are paid trouble shooters.. like automachanics.. that’s what my sister always has said about them, and working around them for 20 years… I AGREE… THEY ARE TROUBLE SHOOTERS WHO WORK FOR INSURANCE COMPANIES.. GOD, YOU’LL DIE OF CANCER BUT THEY’LL GET THEIR STIPEND FOR THE MONTH… DON’T FORGET I SAID THIS.. IT’S THE TRUTH…

  537. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 3:34 pm

    You’ve convinced me Karen. When I have a rare disease, I will go not to a doctor, but a Carrie Underwood concert. Actually, that might make death welcomed.

  538. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 3:41 pm

    Well yes, I think spirit has more healing power than a doctor for sure and faith.. have faith in god.. he’s the protector and will guide you… but of course see a doctor but not just one.. see a bunch.. and if you’re not satisfied.. see a bunch more….

  539. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 3:42 pm

    Yes, because during the Dark Ages, that whole relying solely on God thing worked so well. Please.

  540. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 3:49 pm

    i gotta tell you stevie, I’ve been losing my vision and I’ve been blown off.. and my blood pressure tho, high.. apparently not high enough???? it needs to be higher to get attention apparently… I had to demand an antihypertensive med… apparently it wasn’t the seller of the month.. maybe I should have complained of being blue and I would have gotten an antidepressant.. they always sell well. Hello Zoloft, hello prozac.. believe me I’m pretty embarrassed by this.. and then I partially go blind and I finally get referred to an ED… hello…/?????? I know what you’re saying about Carrie is tongue and cheek.. but honestly it’s not far from the truth… what she offers maybe better than some doctor… haha!!! not kidding at all

  541. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 3:55 pm

    Well I place my faith in science and education. I prefer light to the darkness, knowledge to ignorance.

  542. karen
    October 3, 2009 at 4:01 pm

    Ok, wait until the light guides you to the dark or to nowhere.. and you’ll realize what it is I’m talking about.. b/c I know better… I work in the field..

    You are such a hater of Carrie U.. i think you are blinded by that.. so that’s where you are at… you may never realize.. You are someone that can’t see the invisible spaces.. and that makes you like most.. so I don’t impune you.. but pity you instead.. good luck, hope the scientists you believe in have the answers to the questions.. b/c most are just trouble shooters..

  543. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 4:08 pm

    I’ll tell at work Monday then to give up their work and to try out for American Idol to bring real change and show America what true genius is.

  544. Jon
    October 3, 2009 at 4:33 pm

    And the thread that will not die takes another bizarre turn.

    So, Steve M., I take it you think the Nobel Foundation has made a terrible mistake in giving awards for literature and peace, and ought to cut back to just physics, chemistry and medicine, since – according to you – one can’t be a genius in a non-scientific field?

  545. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 4:38 pm

    Not at all. I am in the humanities myself. But all the truly scary intelligent genius I have met have been in the hard sciences. Besides, the Nobel prize in literature has made some truly bizarre choices at times.

  546. Vicki
    October 3, 2009 at 6:09 pm

    Carrie is not a genius. She has a God given gift for singing. She did graduate top of her class (small high school) and received a college degree with high honors. Now..she does do what I do it seems. Speak before thinking. She is a awful public speaker. She doesn’t make complete sentences, then corrects herself as soon as it comes out like her brain just caught up with her mouth. I find myself saying “Eek, Carrie just shut up and sing girl”. Like last night. Here it was a honorable thing to turn the Opry Pink for Breast Cancer Awareness. She could of said something about praying for those in need, or for those lost. But no, she said stuff like “Whoa..these are the devoted fans for it’s late. It’s past my bedtime” Then she said something stupid, corrected herself, embarrassing laugh… Just Sing Carrie! Now for the CMA’s, she’ll be fine for she’ll read everything.

  547. Phil
    October 3, 2009 at 8:02 pm

    Wow…I thought I heard it all from Carrie’s fans. I guess not.
    Yes, music can heal…it can also help show the cracks of the society one lives in and the values it embraces. I think today’s mainstream music in general does a very good job of showing the narcissistic and image and personality driven, media gaga and celebrity worshipping society we live in today. Our society celebrates the fakeness of everything that is real as evidenced by the booming success of Reality TV shows that are anything but real.
    I don’t know if it is even worth bothering to comment on the Carrie being a “genius” statement. If that were the case, then maybe she could use her talents for something else instead of being another “puppet” created by the Industry to sell music to the masses who don’t have a clue what good music is, and obviously don’t care.
    But let’s keep this about Carrie as an artist and not a person. Because I highly doubt most people here have ever even met her personally, let alone know her personally.
    Just my opinions of course. :)

  548. Dan
    October 3, 2009 at 9:26 pm

    Some people have wondered how in the world could this song generate so many posts within a month’s time? Of course we have the positive ones that are posted in order to defend or to praise Carrie and her song. But, without the negative feedback that this is getting, this thread would have died a long time ago. I think it’s great that everyone can voice their opinion. It can spark debate and it also keeps the thread alive and running.

    I would personally like to thank three people for keeping “Cowboy Casanova” energized. Steve M., you were a little late to the game. But when you entered, you just couldn’t stay away. Thank you. Phil, you have had some of the longest paragrahphs on this song. I am happy that you care so much to get your opinion heard. Artist over personality and image – great concept. Thank you. Stormy, the most thanks goes to you. You have posted over 80 times for “Cowboy Casanova”. That is unreal. Thank you so much.

    Combined, you three have committed to over 25% of these posts. It’s been a month and I felt that you guys deserved some credit for the liveliness of this thread. So, thank you!

  549. Stormy
    October 3, 2009 at 9:39 pm

    What exactly is Carrie doing that helps society? If anything this song makes women look sad, pathetic and weak which is not good for society.

    What does Carrie see that others don’t see? This is the 27th song on this theme in the past 5 years alone.

    As for the video being genuis, I watched it twice and there is no way that there is a twist that Carrie herself is the cowboy. Its just generic. Travis Tritt used to make brilliant videos which served as mini-movies and spun the songs into themes they would not otherwise explore. Anymore is a similar generic unrequited love song, yet every person on this board old enough to remember it instantly thinks of The Vietnam War every time they hear it. This video does not have a Smack My —– Up twist. It is not genuis.

  550. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 9:42 pm

    Well Dan, thanking for counting. And I’d like to thank Carrie Underwood for curing the lepers.

  551. Phil
    October 3, 2009 at 9:52 pm

    Haha…after rewatching Carrie’s video, maybe what I should have said was our society that celebrates the “realness of everything that is fake” instead of the “fakeness of everything that is real” like I did in my previous comment. But I guess both are true.

  552. Phil
    October 3, 2009 at 9:56 pm

    And Dan thank you…oops I forgot why? Oh yeah…for making me laugh.

  553. K
    October 3, 2009 at 10:14 pm

    Why are the name-calling and rudness? Music should be subjective; individuals should be able to enjoy what they want without being ridiculed or teased for their views.

    So Dan (and many others) like the song and others (Phill and Stormy) hate it. So what? Everyone enjoys at least a few songs that are genric radio fluff, and there is nothing wrong with that if people enjoy and debate it.

    Carrie is an extremely talented vocalist, and she should be credited for that wether you hate her, like her or despise her choices of material.

  554. Phil
    October 3, 2009 at 10:35 pm

    I could name off the top of my head at least 20 female artists who are more talented than Carrie as a vocalist in my opinion (and that’s being generous to Carrie)…so I think that is a very subjective opinion as well to call her an “extremely” talented vocalist. Her voice and style doesn’t do anything for me personally because she lacks the emotional connection, interpretation, and delivery in her songs that female artists that I do enjoy listening to have. Just my opinion of course. :)

  555. Steve M.
    October 3, 2009 at 10:49 pm

    I object to anyone who labeling a woman who dated Tony Romo a genus. Given that Romo went on to date Jessica Simpson, that in my mind is guilt by association.

  556. Stormy
    October 3, 2009 at 10:58 pm

    Speaking of the “realness” of the video–give that the rest of the video looks like a Sophie Coppola directed Brittany Speares video set in the 1920′s, why does the “cowboy” in question look like an extra from Mad Men?

  557. Vicki
    October 4, 2009 at 7:27 am

    Honestly, I think it’s Ed her guitar player.

  558. K
    October 4, 2009 at 2:40 pm

    Phil,

    With all due respect, which female artists in country music now are “more talented” than Ms. Underwood? Half of them can’t sing for s*** and Carrie is one of very few that can SING without autotune, antinares, or usless bells and whistles.

    She is the only vocalist in modern country that can even come close to the likes of Martina and company.

    Even if you still have an opinion that many country vocalists are better than Carrie, you won’t even admit she has talent; that is where my main issue is.

  559. Steve M.
    October 4, 2009 at 2:54 pm

    Elizabeth Cook.

  560. K
    October 4, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    Steve,

    I’m talking about modern country artists, not those in the Americana genre.

    As I said, I respect your opinion, but your post above proves my issue. Istead of choosing to at least admit Carrie is talented, you dance around the subject and ignore the point.

  561. Stormy
    October 4, 2009 at 3:22 pm

    Neko Case.

  562. Erik
    October 4, 2009 at 3:36 pm

    Let’s see; Reba, LeAnn Rimes, Trisha Yearwood, Wynonna, Sara Evans and Faith Hill are all immensely more talented than Underwood; who IS talented, but not nearly enough to be a leading figure in the genre.

  563. nm
    October 4, 2009 at 3:52 pm

    Also, Elizabeth Cook considers herself a modern country artist. She was a mainstream artist when she was on Atlantic, and there’s nothing non-mainstream about her music now. She will take the Americana label if it’ll get her music played somewhere, but that’s not how she hears herself. At least, that’s what she has said more than once. And, if you actually listen to her, you hear that she has a point.

  564. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 3:59 pm

    Ummm…did I say current artist K, and did I say Counrty artist? But I’d take Faith Hill, Trisha Yearwood, Reba, Miranda Lambert, Martina McBride, and Kristy Lee Cook over Carrie any day of the week. Someone else will have another list completely different from mine, so it’s not even worth discussing really. Anyway, to me it’s purely subjective about what voice and style somebody prefers (and therefore so is the vocal “talent” of the artist in question), and how he or she feels the artist is able to connect with their songs on an emotional level and interpret and deliver them. And because of the business model Country Music follows, many female Country artists today are having a hard time getting their voices heard on Country radio (and the songs they are expected to release to appease one certain demographic that Country radio seems to be marketing its female artists to doesn’t help either). I don’t blame Carrie or Taylor for that, but I do blame the Industry’s preferential treatment of those two artists in particular to go after that one demographic, and its preferential treatment of the male artists in a genre that has always been male dominated. And Carrie and Taylor have done nothing to help or change that…in fact, their presence has just made it worse, or at least that much more noticeable.
    So I don’t understand why people give Carrie and Taylor any credit whatsoever for opening the doors for other female Country singers. The exact opposite is true, and the Industry seems to be using them both as a coverup for that fact.

  565. Steve M.
    October 4, 2009 at 4:18 pm

    You asked for more talented female artists and I answered. Just because you don’t like the answer doesn’t mean its wrong. And I while fully admit I vastly prefer the Americana genre to “mainstream” if it means judging artists on quality, not pr. Oh, and Kasey Chambers and Kelly Willis, who has more talent in her little finger then Underwood possess.

  566. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 4:42 pm

    Carrie and Taylor are NOT the reasons why other female country artists are not making it huge. Both Carrie and Taylor have hit home runs with each song that they have released. It’s not their fault that other country gals can’t do the same.

    With Carrie, the main complaint is that she already had a huge fan base from American Idol. Every Idol winner (and some non-winnners) have had this fanbase. But, she kept releasing great songs in order to keep her popularity up. There was a long period between “I Told You So” and “Cowboy Casanova” where Carrie was hardly seen or heard. For many artists, this would lose some fans. But, it seems like she has only gained some fans because her new song was well worth the wait.

    With Taylor Swift, she started from the bottom just like everyone else. She proceeded to superstardom because she could write amazing songs that people could relate to. She brought in a new energy that was appealing to most people. So, if Taylor can emerge into a star on her own merit, why can’t others.

    Other can. Taylor and Carrie are not standing in their way. One good song won’t cut it. If they can bring to the table good song after good song with occasional great songs in the mix, then there could easily be someone else standing next to Carrie and Taylor.

  567. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 4:49 pm

    You are entitled to your opinion Dan, and I am entitled to mine. I just happen to see things a little bit differently than you do. I’m not taking anything away from Carrie or Taylor, but I’m not giving them any more credit than what they were designed to do by the Industry in the first place: To bring in a new audience to Country Music. It’s just too bad the Industry decided to alienate many of the fans it already had in the process.

  568. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 5:39 pm

    Country Music needed some shaking up. I’m glad Carrie was able to accomplish what the Industry wanted her to do – create great songs, bring in a wider audience, and remain a classy role model. Without Carrie, I wouldn’t have been attracted to other artists such as Martina McBride, Sugarland, Brad Paisley, Keith Urban, Reba McEntire, or Rascal Flatts. (I would have thrown Taylor in there, but she came after Carrie.)
    This generation desired a change in country music, and we got it. The other “older” artists might have been good back then, but I sure never got into them.
    For fans that feel alienated because times are changing, you should be glad that you can still purchase CD’s (or records) of your favorite artists at stores or antique shops.

  569. K
    October 4, 2009 at 6:43 pm

    “Let’s see; Reba, LeAnn Rimes, Trisha Yearwood, Wynonna, Sara Evans and Faith Hill are all immensely more talented than Underwood; who IS talented, but not nearly enough to be a leading figure in the genre.”

    Carrie is a leading figure in the genre because of her talent; if the women you mentioned above are more talented than her why don’t they have the airplay, fans, and record sales she does?

    It’s a bunch of bull**** that people try to blame the fate of other female artists on more popular ones because they “can’t get a break.” They don’t have the popularity because their “fans” aren’t loyal enough to buy records, concert tickets and such.

    It’s not Carrie’s fault she has a devoted following that chose to do EVERYTHING they can to support her; her following IS the reason why she is so popular. If other females had that privledge, they would be on radio, selling concert tickets, and getting radio airplay.

    Carrie had nowhere to showcase her talent before American Idol; just because she used it as a vehicle and happened to gain a huge following does not mean she is merely a marketing tool for the genre.

    Carrie, Rascal Flatts, Taylor Swift and many others have brought a new sound to the genre that it desperatly needed, if you ask me. Why weren’t Haggard, Jones, and Cash the ones to bring youth to the genre? If they had blazed a new, diverse audience of listeners, why wren’t they gaining new younger fans and worldwide popularity to the genere. If they were still the face of country, the genre wouldn’t have nearly the audience it does now.

    Here’s an idea: If you don’t care for Carrie or her music go spend your time listening to someone you DO consider worthwhile. You must be miserable, having to “tolerate” artists you don’t even like but chose to listen to by your own free will (:

    The same story goes for Swift. Anyone would be lying if they said she didn’t gain her massive appeal through her personality and marketing stratagies via Facebook and weblogs. If she started off as a bar singer without being smart enough to gradually build a following, she would be nowhere.

  570. Stormy
    October 4, 2009 at 6:58 pm

    Carrie, Rascal Flatts, Taylor Swift and many others have brought a new sound to the genre that it desperatly needed, if you ask me. Why weren’t Haggard, Jones, and Cash the ones to bring youth to the genre? If they had blazed a new, diverse audience of listeners, why wren’t they gaining new younger fans and worldwide popularity to the genere. If they were still the face of country, the genre wouldn’t have nearly the audience it does now.

    Johnny Cash remains one of the top selling “country” artists out there, despite being dead for 6 years.
    Merle still sells out shows around the country.

  571. Steve M.
    October 4, 2009 at 6:58 pm

    Again, you are mistaking popularity for quality. Transformers 2 was one of the biggest grossing movies of the year. Should we consider to be Oscar worthy? So what if Underwood has legions of mindless fans? They are probably the same ones who who went and saw Transformers 2.

  572. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 7:05 pm

    Have you ever heard of Popular Opinion K? It’s not always right…and it is popular opinion because it is somebody’s agenda to see to it that it is popular opinion. You can fool most of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all the time. My only agenda is to see to it that other female Country artists are given a fair chance by the Industry, and the Country Music Industry markets its female artists to a wider audience than the Carrie and Taylor audience they seem so intent on catering their music to, and the singles that Country radio plays by them. It’s basically like watching American Idol all year long…now it’s time for a new show and something better with a little more variety to offer.

  573. K
    October 4, 2009 at 7:08 pm

    “Here’s an idea: If you don’t care for Carrie or her music go spend your time listening to someone you DO consider worthwhile. You must be miserable, having to “tolerate” artists you don’t even like but chose to listen to by your own free will”

    You guys must have missed that part of my comment…thought I’d post it again so you can stop to this artist and let people who enjoy her do so (:

  574. Steve M.
    October 4, 2009 at 7:15 pm

    Because Underwood is part of the problem with country music. And to remain silent would be as big of a crime as her music is.

  575. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 7:21 pm

    Well, if you don’t like my opinions K, you don’t have to read them. And this is a bigger issue to me than whether or not I like Carrie’s Music. I do enjoy reading your opinions though, and I respect them. It doesn’t mean I agree with them though. :)

  576. sam
    October 4, 2009 at 7:25 pm

    We shouldn’t confuse popularity for quality. A lot of popular stuff is junk. But if something is popular, it is quite likely that it is bringing pleasure to people, regardless of whether it is junk. Junk may have its place.

    If Carrie’s fans keep buying tickets and CDs, they presumably think her offerings are more valuable than the ticket/CD price, and thus Carrie is adding value to their lives.

    Steve M says, “So what if Underwood has legions of mindless fans?” Well mindless people deserve to be entertained too, (in fact, they deserve entertainment no less than mindful people) and if Underwood is providing them with some kind of benefit, that is to her credit, not to her discredit.

    Anyway, if Underwood makes music for mindless people, its not as if the primary target for George Jones songs such as ‘High Tech Redneck,” “The Corvette Song,” and “Why Baby Why” is likely to be MENSA members. Perhaps Haggard, Jones and Cash are more sophisticated than Underwood, but I think those singers are also vulnerable to the “lack of sophistication” argument.

  577. Steve M.
    October 4, 2009 at 7:25 pm

    I echo Phil’s sentiments. While my criticism isn’t meant to be personal, i just see the popularity of her music as part of a general problem in society accepting, and even honoring mediocrity because it is backed by a big time pr and hype campaign.

  578. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 7:58 pm

    Whether you like it or not, Steve M., you are adding immensely to the Carrie Underwood hype by faithfully sticking to this board. I mean at the rate we’re going, this “Cowboy Casanova” thread will reach 1,000 posts by the time her third cd is released. You are helping the Carrie cause and the help from you won’t stop coming until you decide when to stop.

    Stormy,keep on coming with the posts. You are so close to 100. We think you can, we think you can!

  579. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 8:05 pm

    The “Carrie cause?” What exactly is that Dan? Good one. I can’t wait to hear your explanation. :)

  580. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 8:25 pm

    The Carrie Cause is the ability to keep Carrie Underwood active – even when she isn’t doing anything. Her music video was just released and her next big thing is her CD release. By keeping this thread alive, (whether positive or negative), Carrie is still on everyone’s minds – which ultimately will resolve in a HUGE first week sales for her CD. This thread might just be a little thing, but every little thing accumulates into one big thing. The one big thing will always work to the benefit of the artist being discussed about.

    So everyone posting on this thread is helping the Carrie Cause.

  581. Razor X
    October 4, 2009 at 8:48 pm

    Carrie, Rascal Flatts, Taylor Swift and many others have brought a new sound to the genre that it desperatly needed, if you ask me. Why weren’t Haggard, Jones, and Cash the ones to bring youth to the genre? If they had blazed a new, diverse audience of listeners, why wren’t they gaining new younger fans and worldwide popularity to the genere. If they were still the face of country, the genre wouldn’t have nearly the audience it does now.

    I don’t understand why some people continue to argue that an increased audience is a good thing, when it comes with such a hefty price tag: i.e., the transformation of the genre almost beyond recognition. If country music has to morph into pop music to gain an audience share, why is that a good thing? Since when is it an accomplishment to sell a lot of pop records? That is nothing new.

    I would much rather prefer that country music had a smaller audience that appreciated it for what it was, as opposed to a larger one that supports acts like Rascal Flatts, Taylor, and Carrie.

  582. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 9:22 pm

    Well then, I’ll just chalk the “Carrie cause” as nothing more than another thing the Industry created. That along with all the other stuff I’ve already brought up. Thanks for the explanation Dan. :)

  583. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 9:37 pm

    That’s awesome. We all appreciate the support!

  584. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 9:47 pm

    Now you just sound like an old “Bartles And James” commercial Dan. Remember those? That’s what this “Carrie cause” will be soon enough as well. A distant memory.

  585. Vicki
    October 4, 2009 at 9:48 pm

    Please website monitors..ENOUGH ALREADY..close this blog. PU-LEASE!

  586. Wade
    October 4, 2009 at 9:51 pm

    Razor X, its like youre reading my mind. I also dont understand why country has to have a bigger audience when it means changing (into something much worse i might add) to gain that audience…

  587. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 10:18 pm

    Phil: You said it will be a distant memory. Well, it’s really up to you. But I’m guessing you won’t be able to stay away that long. You seem rather infatuated with “Cowboy Casanova” for a guy claiming he thinks it’s awful. But, you’re a person who likes to keep things running. Will you be the 600th comment? I mean, could you resist? Carrie does have a way of getting noticed even when she’s not doing anything interesting. It’s people like you and I that keep her name floating about in preparation for the next big event to happen in her life. So, you can call this Industry created, but you’re playing right into the palm of their hand.

  588. Razor X
    October 4, 2009 at 10:28 pm

    Carrie does have a way of getting noticed even when she’s not doing anything interesting.

    She has yet to do anything interesting.

  589. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 10:34 pm

    Infatuated? Not the word I’d choose since most of my comments really have nothing to do with the song itself anyway. If I’m playing into the palm of the Industry’s hand, then it will be bitten off soon enough. You can only keep the dogs away for so long before they sense rotten meat and want to take a bite out of it. Here’s your commercial Dan. And I’m not keeping track of the number of comments like you. Maybe you are the one infatuated? Just a guess.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1tMxpe2670

  590. Dan
    October 4, 2009 at 11:23 pm

    It only took you 16 minutes. I knew you would be back soon.

    I know this doesn’t apply to you, but I find it a waste of time to comment on an artist I do not enjoy listening to. I said that you must be infatuated with the song because you repeatedly reply to the thread of the song you don’t like.

    But, like I said earlier, I really don’t mind you posting because this way Carrie Underwood still gets emphasized. All in all, it makes Carrie more popular and you’re partially to blame.

    By the way, I have never seen that commercial in my life. But that last comment in it made me chuckle a bit!

  591. kevin w
    October 4, 2009 at 11:31 pm

    Carrie does have a way of getting noticed even when she’s not doing anything interesting.

    She has yet to do anything interesting.

    But you feel the need to respond anyway.

  592. Phil
    October 4, 2009 at 11:40 pm

    Haha…well, Dan you do know your fruit…but music, not so much. And you are good at counting.
    Wow…I shudder to think how I could be responsible for making Carrie more popular. I don’t think that is possible.
    But I think I stated that my comments in general are more aimed at the Industry and what they have blatantly created than they are at Carrie Underwood. She just so happens to be a part of the Industry’s overall strategy that I completely disagree with. If it weren’t Carrie Underwood, it would have been somebody else of the Industry’s choosing we were discussing. Just my opinions of course.

  593. sam
    October 4, 2009 at 11:55 pm

    Carrie is pretty good in my view and I am definitely glad she is on the radio now and some of the 90s acts are not.

    I started listening to country in 1991, and loved the 90s acts. But most of them have grown stale. Carrie isn’t some kind of musical genius but I’m glad she is on the radio. I’d much rather here “Cowboy Casanova” by Carrie than “High Tech Redneck” or some other junkola by George Jones.

  594. K
    October 4, 2009 at 11:58 pm

    “I don’t understand why some people continue to argue that an increased audience is a good thing.”

    Obviously it’s working with so many country artists getting recognition from outside the community, which didn’t seem common 10-20 years ago.

    If you want to blame the “demise” of country on anyone, blame Garth and Shania, they started the whole thing as far as I’m concerned.

  595. Phil
    October 5, 2009 at 12:31 am

    You could probably go back further than that if you wanted to K…but like I said, I’m not really blaming any “artists” so much as I am the Industry.
    At least Garth and Shania’s music was relateable to a wider audience and wasn’t gender specific for the most part (sure, some songs were…but not all). Whereas Carrie and Taylor’s music is desinged to go after one specific audience, is gender specific, and leaves out a whole demographic in the process. That is the problem I have with the Industry’s strategy. Because the audience they are bringing in are loyal to Taylor and Carrie…and not to Country Music. That is the catch 22 the Industry will find itself facing in the future when Carrie and Taylor are no longer around to appease those fans who are loyal to them, and not to the genre they just so happen to be getting airplay from on the radio. In the short term it’s just one big popularity contest and all the female artists are being compared to one another with all the money going to Carrie and Taylor. In the long term it’s a death sentence to Country Music. That’s just the way I see it. But time will tell, and there is still time to right the ship and choose another direction before the hurricane hits…hopefully far away from that hurricane. But right now it is going full speed into ahead headed right for the hurricane.

  596. sam
    October 5, 2009 at 1:39 am

    If Carrie and Taylor and what not appeal to a certain demographic, that’s fair, but I wouldn’t be too surprised to learn that George Jones and Loretta Lynn and Tammy Wynette and Hank Williams and Hank Jr appealed to certain demographics, too, and that those artists all but alienated certain other demographics.

    Perhaps Garth and Shania appealed to more genders than Swift and Underwood, though I am not really sure if this is true. But even if it is, I’m not sure that this is some sort of problem. Its quite possible that Carrie Underwood has appeal to more demographics (at least among those who buy music) than George Jones ever did.

    Also how do we know that Carrie and Taylor fans are loyal just to those artists and that they do not buy CDs from other country radio artists?

  597. Stormy
    October 5, 2009 at 6:43 am

    k:
    10-20 years ago country music crossed over into pop culture in a way it does not do today.

  598. Phil
    October 5, 2009 at 7:05 am

    Sam, they may buy CD’s from other Country artists, but look at how CD sales are down across the board in Country Music. Especially by the female artists (besides Carrie and Taylor). But it does not mean they will be loyal to Country Music 10 to 20 years from now…let alone 5 years from now.
    As far as the demographics go: Well, like I said, they are appealing to an overall audience that is more interested in personality and image and the person the artist is, rather than the artist that person is. But they are tayloring their product exclusively to an audience that is predominantly female for the most part. How this will play out in the future? Time will tell.

  599. karen
    October 6, 2009 at 1:09 am

    I listen to Carrie… I also just bought Miranda Lamberts Revolution, I have Reba’s music, Trace Adkins, Brad Paisley, Phil Vassar, Taylor Swift, Johnny Cash, Julie Roberts, Kellie Pickler, Blake Shelton, Jeffrey Steele.. Sara Evens, Faith Hill, Tim Mcgraw, hmmm… and I just started listening to country about a year ago.. altho I am a fan of Underwood since “before he cheats”… never watched her on idol at all… my sister got me into country.. she listens to it quite a bit..

  600. karen
    October 6, 2009 at 1:24 am

    I’ll say something else too… I’m a 40 something female that lives in the NE.. yes, there are people in the NE that listen to country.. it’s probably an older fanbase.. Trace Adkins sold out in my area.. and a few women from my work went to it, they are in my age group for sure. I think country music is tapping that new demographic for sure. It’s not a huge population of music buyers or downloaders since most women my age aren’t that tech savvy, work full time jobs have families etc.. they probably get their kids to download for them. Also several young girls I work with go to Kenny Chesney.. he plays along with others every summer at Gillette Stadium.. it sells out every summer to like 80,000 country music fans here in my state

  601. Dan
    October 8, 2009 at 11:20 am

    Only after 5 weeks, “Cowboy Casanova” is a top 10 hit! This week on country songs, it moved from number 11 to number 8!

  602. The Critic
    October 17, 2009 at 1:44 pm

    The song is OK. It isn’t as bad as some would suggest, but it isn’t anything worth excitement either. It could be summed up in the phrase “That boy is trouble, so watch out.” But the imagery is not bad and the melody is about as hypnotic as the ‘Casanova’ the song is about. The song is far from excellent, but it is not wholly a waste. It is alright for dancing and it hopefully will have cross over appeal, as it is far from country. The video on the other hand is not even worth a defense.

    I hope that we can move beyond the pettiness and show some respect for the opinions of others. Let’s not try to degrade the statements of the opposing view by suggesting that certain fans/critics that you disagree with are ‘brainwashed’ or ‘fan bots’ it does nothing to advance conversation but breed anger.

    Enjoy the music. Avoid the video.

  603. Dan
    October 17, 2009 at 11:14 pm

    Enjoy the music. Enjoy the video.

  604. Dan
    October 20, 2009 at 8:13 pm

    Only 14 more days until “Play On” is finally here. It’s gonna be so fun to see the Billboard charts liven up again with this release. Overall, “Cowboy Casanova” was well received. A great first single (especially from Carrie) will translate well with sales. The 30 second clips of all her new songs sound amazing and she’ll show everyone once again that she is here for the long haul. Besides “Cowboy Casanova”, I’m really into the songs of “Quitter”, “Change”, “Temporary Home”, “Unapologize”, and “Play On”. She delivers quality music with an honest heart and a playful spirit.

    Also, I can’t wait for her holiday special!

  605. Fred
    October 23, 2009 at 5:26 am

    Like the song, very catchy. I also like Quitter, Temporary Home, and What Can I Say. Can’t wait for the album on Nov. 3 – Play On!

  606. Caitlin
    December 28, 2009 at 3:53 pm

    I think Carie Underwood is amazing and I am obsessed with this song. You people are over thinking this stuff WAY to much. Either the song is good, or it’s bad. That simple. This song is #1 right now, Carrie has an amazing voice, and the song is catchy and a lot of people are really overthinking it. Overthinking a song and complaining about it. Hm. This is where I say: GET A LIFE HATERS!!! I <3 this song!!!

  607. Dani
    December 31, 2009 at 2:58 pm

    I think this is a good song. I like it, but when I watched the music video it ruined it for me. Oh well. It’s still a good song. I love Carrie’s voice and I like how clear she is.

  608. Razor X
    December 31, 2009 at 3:11 pm

    Either the song is good, or it’s bad. That simple.

    It’s bad. Happy now?

  609. Dan E.
    December 31, 2009 at 5:01 pm

    It’s good. Simple as that!

  610. Steve M.
    December 31, 2009 at 8:01 pm

    It actually more resembles the droppings of an ox who drank too much prune juice.

  611. sam (sam)
    December 31, 2009 at 8:07 pm

    I think its a decent song (not bad but not great) but Carrie’s performance makes it quite enjoyable. I like it. I think its a good single for the radio.

  612. TexasVet
    December 31, 2009 at 8:34 pm

    It actually more resembles the droppings of an ox who drank too much prune juice.

    How did it taste Steve M?

  613. Dan E.
    January 20, 2010 at 11:50 pm

    “Cowboy Casanova” has just recently reached platinum status in digital downloads.

  614. sarah
    March 10, 2010 at 9:20 am

    you rock love ya

  615. Ben Foster
    March 15, 2010 at 7:31 pm

    I actually liked “Cowboy Casanova.” I thought it sounded sharply different from anything else Underwood had ever recorded. And there has been a shortage of good line-dancing songs lately. Rather than deeming it a waste of talent, I conisder it an example of how our beloved Carrie has grown as an artist in the course of her amazing career. Thumbs UP from me.

  616. Vicki
    March 15, 2010 at 8:03 pm

    Check out this Carrie and Craig Morgan duet of Alan Jackson’s “Neon Rainbow”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74uL_rageRE

  617. Carlie
    May 31, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    I don’t know why this idiot Jim Malec decides to review Carrie’s stuff.
    All he does is give her a thumbs-down on everything she does.
    He can just stick to reviewing Miranda Lambert and Reba McEntire since those are his only preferences because he’s a biased ASS.

  618. Stormy
    May 31, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Weird, isn’t it, how country fans prefer country music.

  619. Steve M.
    May 31, 2010 at 5:24 pm

    Do you really think calling people idiots will convince anyone that you are right? What are you, 12?

  620. Jon
    May 31, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    As opposed to the guy who keeps calling Underwood a “peroxide blonde,” who must be all of 13.

  621. Steve M.
    June 1, 2010 at 12:51 am

    Well give she is, how is my statement inaccurate?

  622. Jon G.
    June 1, 2010 at 1:27 am

    Steve M., it isn’t. “Peroxide blonde” is a good descriptive term…I mean, that’s what I would call her haircolor and all, just looking at it. In fact, I’m not sure how this could even be argued.

    Kind of off-topic, but did anyone else feel gypped when the video for “Cowboy Casanova” didn’t even have a cowboy in it? I mean, there’s not much cowboy in the production, and Carrie is obviously not a cowboy. Shouldn’t there be a rule or something?

  623. Stormy
    June 1, 2010 at 7:51 am

    To be fair, Carrie is a natural blonde. Insert joke here.

  624. Jon
    June 1, 2010 at 7:59 am

    I don’t know whether it’s inaccurate, but deploying it as a criticism – which you’ve repeatedly done – is simply puerile, especially when the person using it holds himself out to be one of a particularly refined and discerning taste and intellect.

  625. Dan E
    June 1, 2010 at 9:06 am

    Jon G.: The music video was fine just the way it was!

  626. joannathan
    October 22, 2012 at 2:59 pm

    LOL! The spam messages that have taken over this site are pretty sad but not as pathetic as Jon fighting over nonsense with the other posters. No wonder the 9513 died out. Its a shame!

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